Goldplat Share Discussion Threads

[kimboy2] 07/4/2017 10:46

The limiting factor is capital and how you best deploy what you have within any particular time period.

They have expanded kili. The p/e is probably less than 1 and may well lead on to other beneficial development, as well as further profitable expansion.

They are investing working capital in South America. This money can perhaps be recycled two or three times a year. We have yet to see what the financial benefit will be, however I suspect the p/e will be less than 1.

There is an elution column going up in Ghana this year which will cost $2m.

The loan has got to help and hopefully rapidly expanding cash flow will enable them to bring investments forward.

[sea7] 07/4/2017 10:29

I have said this to Gerard, KB, in so much that the more elution capacity, the less concentrate and more bullion for the easier and quicker refining process.

[kimboy2] 07/4/2017 10:27

IMV the priority should be to expand the elution capacity as quickly as possible. It will increase profitability, reduce dependence on others, improve cash flow, reduce working capital and increase output.

[sea7] 07/4/2017 10:08

shareholder,

We also have to consider the fact that a lot of goldplats customers require the gold back and not cash. We have to pay for the cost of bullion transfer from Germany and not from Germiston.

[shareholder7] 07/4/2017 09:59

Great points KimB and one will bill in Euros and the other Rand so there is a currency issueAlso we don't know what Aurubus charges or their payment terms vers RR unless you are working for GDP and you know this

[sea7] 07/4/2017 09:58

rand timelines...

Back in July 2007 goldplat signed an agreement with rand refinery. Demetri said at the time....

The agreement with Rand Refinery is a strategic alliance, under which Goldplat has first right of refusal to process all Rand Refinery's by-products not suitable for its own refining process. In turn, Rand Refinery, which already refines the bullion produced by Goldplat in South Africa, has exclusive rights to refine Goldplat's Ghanaian production.

June 2012..

Demetri stated...

Rand Refinery, Goldplat Recovery's strategic partner, has expressed its intention to expand the cooperation between the two companies in South Africa, East and West Africa. The strategy is to utilise Goldplat's recovery operations to upgrade material to such a grade that it is viable for Rand Refinery to process the concentrated material in its works. Joint Ventures will be considered if required.

.......................................
Demetri stepped down September 2012.
...................................

subtle hints in reports from 2012 to 2014 of delays/issues at goldplat

October 2014

ian visagie ceo states..

Whilst Q1 2015 has seen a robust performance operationally GPL's cash position has deteriorated during Q1 2015 as deliveries of concentrates were not made to Goldplat's third party refinery as a result of temporary industrial strike action and subsequent delays at the refinery.

December 2014 ian visagie states... (This is where Ian rattled their cage, whilst they were dealing with strike issues).....

GPL is in discussions with Rand Refinery, to redefine the relationship between the two companies for the longer term benefit of both.

Two months later Gerard takes over as CEO, when he was meant to be taking over as chairman.

March 2015 brian states...

Both GPL and Gold Recovery Ghana ('GRG') have been impacted by continuing difficulties with our third party refiner, Rand Refinery, to which traditionally we have sold a substantial proportion of concentrate product (primarily ashes and carbon). Rand Refinery's decision not to receive and process concentrates during the period has resulted in a substantial build-up in product stocks and consequently Goldplat's customers are withholding further deliveries pending the clearance of the backlog.

June 2015 Gerard states..

Rand Refinery has started to process a small amount of certain categories of the backlog materials on a limited basis to assist in clearing the backlog

September 2015 Gerard states..

GPL has entered into a contract with its third party refining partner, Rand Refinery whereby GPL will toll-process a large batch of by-product material for Rand Refinery


Where Rand Refinery has not been able to accept and process certain Goldplat material (which is now mostly being processed in-house and through Aurubis Refinery in Germany), they have now begun accepting batches of ashes again albeit in limited quantities and on an ad-hoc basis.

and

Regarding Rand Refinery, we are pleased that despite the challenges, the relationship between Goldplat and Rand Refinery is strong and that we continue to find mutually beneficial ways to work together

April 2016

The majority of the concentrates produced during the period went to Rand Refinery in South Africa, reducing the turnaround time significantly.

July 2016 - dispute arises over silver sulphide contract with rand

October 2016 -

The independent investigation concerning the dispute with Rand Refinery regarding the silver sulphide toll recovery project is still in process but has been separated from the day-to-day operations between the two companies.
Notwithstanding the dispute with Rand Refinery, Goldplat continues to deliver concentrates to Rand Refinery, which has improved its turnaround time significantly.

April 2017 - goldplat vindicated in independent report over the silver sulphide contract. Rand refuse to pay up and legal action is likely. No further business with rand refinery at all, at this time.

...............

What do I deduce from this, is that Demetri had a good working relationship with rand, which began to break down after he left goldplat. Russel did nothing with them and Ian tried to renegotiate contracts with them when they were having strike issues and it doesn't appear to have gone well. Gerard took over shortly after and things appeared to be getting better, however, that has not been the case as we know.

Perhaps they still have an axe to grind after Ian tried renegotiating with them and it appears to have gone wrong.

[kimboy2] 07/4/2017 09:48

7. How much RR charge and how much Aurubis charge
8. How soon RR pay and how soon Aurubis pay

As to competitors if you looked at the admission document you would have seen that one of the competitors was Rand Refinery.

I don't think that they were getting much material from RR. Indeed the cotract was meant to be an ice breaker. Despite this GDP has record amounts of material to process.

[danielmiller1] 07/4/2017 09:46

Man talk about going around in circles


And the costs of litigation have yet to rear up its head.

What are a
L these new board members doing or are they just there for a payoff!

Eithway it's the shareholders who will get it in the neck... C. Or should that be pocket?

Lolololololololololololololololololol

[shareholder7] 07/4/2017 09:41

Well you don't need to be too clever to work this out 1. Distance from material that GDP processes in South Africa to RR next door2. Distance from material that GDP processes in South Africa to Germany 3. EU regulations and bureaucracy4. Possible vat chargers ( need to look into this )5. More chance of Materials going missing 6. Increase lead times Interesting you did not comment on possible competition in SA and what RR will do with all their other material that GDP could have got

[kimboy2] 07/4/2017 09:30

Seriously though, good points made by DD and S7 and costs will go up and lead times will extend

Do you know this to be true? I am told it isn't.

You may remember that as part of this argument RR stopped taking material around August time and the profit in Q1/17 was extremely strong despite this. Indeed South Africa was at record levels in terms of profit and gold processed.

As a result of this stoppage I would suspect that the amount of material going to RR had been substantially reduced.

[shareholder7] 07/4/2017 09:21

Don't give up DD let's see what pans out just don't post on the GDP fan club board.Interesting if you go to google and key in "Gold Refineries Germany" Aurubis is not to be found But if you key in "Copper Refineries Germany" they are number 3 Let's hope they don't get the gold confused with their copper Interesting company www.aurubis.com Seriously though, good points made by DD and S7 and costs will go up and lead times will extend Then what will RR do with all the material sitting in their yard needing processing You can bet they will find another GDP to help and go out of their way to give it to another vendorI never got an answer from GDP as to who their competitors are always very cagey when asked.I think this is the biggest mistake Gerard has made to date, if the RR contract would have worked there is more material coming that is just next door to them They should have monitored this on a weekly basis and kept RR informed. They are / where the senior partnerThis is crazy and the best business advice I ever got was"Never confuse pride with making money "I am afraid that pride is hitting GDP in the face

[sea7] 07/4/2017 09:14

MF - tks, I have worked with germans before and I have always found them to be efficient and they do get upset when efficiency drops off!!!

[michaelfenton] 07/4/2017 09:07

sea7 - agreed on all points.

[discodave4] 07/4/2017 09:05

Good luck too S7.

[sea7] 07/4/2017 08:58

Good luck in your other investments DD, see you later.

[discodave4] 07/4/2017 08:57

I see the GDP sponsored board has returned to a degree of normality, completely missing the bigger picture, glossing over any negatives and it's now all for the better!....jeez, it's been 9 months of heads completely buried into sand.All the best S7, doubt I will bother posting my views on here again........will only post to have a pop at certain individuals.....when the time is right!.DD

[sea7] 07/4/2017 08:55

I expected to hear exactly what I did hear!!

You are right, in so much as an 80% uplift in material going to Germany will cost more and may add to the pipeline time. We may see the company relying on some of this loan cash In the very short term to cover payments to clients who are not expecting payment to be delayed in any way. The current pipleline is 5 months at Aurubis, which is one to two months longer than rands normal turnaround for concentrate.

Same day bullion refining at rand may end up being two to four days in Germany, allowing for travelling time.

All Gerard will do is delay the explo drilling if necessary by a couple of months to allow for any additional pipeline time to be filled and the steady stream of revenue returned to normal.

[discodave4] 07/4/2017 08:51

PS Do you also think that the German refineries are not going to take advantage of this situation, I know I would!.......short and curly's springs to mind.DD

[discodave4] 07/4/2017 08:49

No offence S7 but what response did you expect!.80% just isn't going to be switched just like that, naive to think it will. This will cost GDP, the loan was not for addressing this issue, that was GKG's pocket money to spend on his exploration whim. You know how much drilling and getting to JORC costs!.DD

[sea7] 07/4/2017 08:33

MF,

Obvious answer there at this time!!!

The working relationship with german refiners is new and fresh. The culture in Germany is also significantly different to that in Gauteng and the germans will turn the product around swiftly and efficiently. That is what they are like.

[michaelfenton] 07/4/2017 08:30

Well ask the obvious question who would you trust RR or German refiners? I think I know the answer. Maybe in the longrun this will all be for the best.

[sea7] 07/4/2017 08:29

I guess the use of refiners that are not in the neighbourhood does have the benefit of a more distant relationship. Neighbours are notorious for being in each others faces sooner or later.

[sea7] 07/4/2017 08:27

DD,

I emailed Gerard and that was the response I got. It was what I expected to hear. You do not take someone to court and still expect, open, transparent and friendly business at the same time.

They do still have contracts, however, who they get the material refined or processed with is not likely to be part of those contracts.

The CEO at rand is publicly claiming breach of contract and failure to perform, whereas Gerard says otherwise, so we will need to wait to see who is being honest with the truth and who is being somewhat economical with it.