Euro.Mins. Share Discussion Threads

[sg31] 18/4/2008 22:59

George,with the number of shares you own in EUM you could probably block this on your own.

[ukgeorge] 18/4/2008 22:46

i just put a bid in for the remainder of eum's mine, i offered some magic beans. somehow i dont think i will get a reply.

[sg31] 18/4/2008 22:20

Dona,Yes it is the same person,i mistyped it in my haste.I have just been trying to find his history,but couldn't turn it up quickly so the following is from memory and may not be 100% accurate.Kurzin came to UK in about 1990,he and Williams have history,they worked together at Kazmin which morphed into EUM.Kurzin went off to set up Oriel.Williams stayed with EUM.He has extensive contacts in Kaz and FSU.He seems to be good at corporate deals arranging buy outs between companies he is involved with,all slightly incestuous.Someone else may be able to put a bit more meat on the bones.

[donaferentes] 18/4/2008 20:57

sorry, chipperfrd, you're right - lot to take in. but if the deal is concluded, won't the new company be repaying principal + interest to itself effectively? I guess it's structured like this for the eventuality that they do not conclude and can convert loan to shares at a discount.

sg31 - is Kurzov you refer to the same as Kurzin who's becoming exec chair?

[chipperfrd] 18/4/2008 19:46

donaferentes,

I read that the $25m was at an annual rate of 10% and due to be repaid by 31/12/08. If not, they can convert to EUM shares at 95% of market price.

There is some info on LER (to premium users) on this site. Not a great deal on their website, although a recent presentation there, does help a bit.

[sg31] 18/4/2008 19:39

P bear your prospective valuation of ORI is the same as mine,Like you i am sickened by the takeover,shareholders took all the risks and then got shafted.Life moves on but to see the same crew appear here is too much.I made money on ORI but not as much as i should have.I am questioning my involvement in the 'stans,

[p bear] 18/4/2008 19:21

The sheer mention of ORI is making me even more sick! (I use to be a FeCr trader and knew just how much ORI would of been worth, and the 220UScent a share was about a fifth of it). EUM let's wait and see.

I need a break - UKGeorge what other stocks are you into and rate as interesting, good value/risk/reward.

(P.S. I also think you need to take your mind off ORI/EUM, you seem rather tense!)

[ukgeorge] 18/4/2008 18:54

4/7/2008 4:54:35 PM | No Recommendation | 46 reads | Post #23002470 Rate
Looks like a good time to cash some of these in. If you want a gold copper mine in an fsu country take a look at epm. european minerals unlike these they have built the mine allready and are ramping up to full production at present. and what is even better their share price has come down to under a $ for you to get in at.

take a look at epm very similar to these just a lot further down the road.

i posted this on the lero board i guess they new far more about eum than me.

[sg31] 18/4/2008 18:45

This is a stitch up,Kurzov was the chairman of Oriel,they have just been taken over at a ridiculously low price,the shares were trading at £1 approx,the ferro chrome price increased from £1.20 to £1.90 on the 1/4/08,Oriels mine was due on stream in the next couple of months.Their smelter was profitable and would soon be supplied by their own mine.A perfect position and due to be vastly profitable.THEY THEN ACCEPTED A T/O AT £1.10.Daylight robbery.Shareholders shafted.
EUM have a temporary funding problem,now they have taken over LER,watch who takes control,not who is the figure head but who wields power,it will be Kurzov.Unless i am mistaken this will be sold out from under our feet at some stage when it suits them and when they can get it on the cheap.I am not saying we wont make some money in the interim but we will be royaly shafted at some stage.

[donaferentes] 18/4/2008 18:35

P Bear - didn't mean my post to be the bright side, but wanted to take the edge off the instinctive response that more shares in issue was only dilutive.

The $25m loan is not at 10% by the way - only the $5m bridge is until closing of the merger. The $25m are on terms still to be agreed between two parts of the same new company - should cost approx. zero net.

Cannacord are clear winners here and I would suspect the Lero mgt who come onto the main board. If one of them is Exec Chair what happens to TW non-exec chair - follow up RNS, as soon as the deal cemented, announcing his retirement and a nice fat cheque? That's the major concern for me - the new mgt, knowing nothing about Lero prospects or how they have been run.

Where can I get more on Lero - Digital Look my main source does not list it? TIA.

A lot of wood to clear before the trees become clear. No idea which way this will go on TSX Monday or AIM on end of suspension. Surely they should have lined up a new NOMAD to be part of the announcement if EUM were a willing or unsurprised party - maybe Monday, maybe no one will touch them, who knows? On the other hand, surely Canna have brought EUM major holders along with them this far? How long did this take to develop and become concrete? No mention by TW of such esoteric ways of bridging their w/c gap in his last statement.

The unknown is scary, but I do not see EUM as having been so weak they had to enter a fire sale, so there should be some value/merit to the deal.

How long till Lero assets start producing?

Qvestions, qvestions - alvays viz ze qvestions!

Happy weekend everyone.

[p bear] 18/4/2008 17:46

That's the bright side. The dust might settle and this might be an excellent thing and the price will move north.

But I have to agree with UKG right now - it's a major kick in the balls.

Looking at the Lero and EUM chart makes me sick. Note to self: if something seems to good to be true, it normally is.

[donaferentes] 18/4/2008 17:12

UKG - "dilution 20%-30% kick in the balls"

Not a bit - we also get added concentrate because we own 72-81% of Lero as well as 72-81% of EUM. The diluytion for all parties is Cannacord's 15% option if exercised and the additional C$20m of placing they can make at their discretion - not too bad as the cost of acquiring new assets.

Good news each EUM share is valued at 98c - not today's price of nearer 90c.

My reading is:-
Basically Cannacord were fund-raising for Lero anyway (under punitive terms 15% option but wtf). Their other client EUM needed bridging loan, so they suggested a merger whereby part of the funds raised for Lero not needed for 6-9 months could be loaned to EUM. Cannacord earn fees and options all round. They need to stick as NOMAD with Lero not EUM 'cos that's who they're raising the cash for through their contacts - but only a technical not a negative resignation from EUM.

Having swallowed Cannacord's costs, the new unit will be using EUM's future cashflow to fund Lero's future asset development. So, dust settled, some questions:-
How good are Lero's assets and their senior management who are coming on board en masse?
Who now will actually run the company? Has this in fact been akin to a reverse takeover?

Us PI's will truly find this hard to fathom without a good deal more time, thought and information.

Happy to hear any contrary views and MORE INFORMATION PLEASE.

[chrismisson555] 18/4/2008 16:01

So what are we expecting.

1. Dilution 170m at 0.9
2. Resource news from EPM
3. Resource news from LER

If this is as good as the CEO:s say then we should make a recovery back to at least 1.1 because the financial mess is sorted out, if not then we are going to be at low low prices until at least next year on the back of the mass dilution.

[chrismisson555] 18/4/2008 15:54

Why didnt they buy lero a month ago or even two weeks ago at a higher price.

[chipperfrd] 18/4/2008 15:41

They have to suspend under AIM rules until they replace the NOMAD.

[chrismisson555] 18/4/2008 15:36

And they suspend AIM shares!! the cheek.

[chipperfrd] 18/4/2008 15:34

Difficult to get a good grasp of the numbers yet. But it looks like LER have issued 47m shares to get their $40m, plus Canna get an option for another 15% (I think). So total number of LER shares is likely to be around 120-130m!

All these shares will exchanged on a 1:1 basis for EUM shares.

Will probably need to see how the dust settles around this deal but as LER only has early-stage projects in the FSU it looks like they will be the big winners by securing EUM cashflow to fund through development, etc.

In the short term EUM get a cash bail-out for their shortfall on hedge and debt commitments so should be able to survive through to commercial production. But I can't help thinking this has been a bit of a fit-up and raising cash by other means would have been better for holders.

[chrismisson555] 18/4/2008 15:33

Canada not liking it and I am not surprised, why didnt they annouce anything in the last month pointing towards this, corruption springs to mind

[chrismisson555] 18/4/2008 15:28

This is crazy!!

[ukgeorge] 18/4/2008 15:18

suspended on aim thats why you are having problem.
dilution 20%-30% kick in the balls but + cash to get going and potential for future projects.
the private investor as normal has been screwed allways last to know, look at how lero price has risen as our share price fell, people obviously knew.

[p bear] 18/4/2008 15:17

Of course I am having problems - trading has been suspended!

[p bear] 18/4/2008 15:11

Wasn't Lero part of Oriel at one time. I see the eagle (Oriel being Russian for eagle) in their logo.

Hope this is a turning point. I having a problem putting an order through even for a small quality.