Distil Share Discussion Threads

[berny3] 26/2/2018 20:17

Just another quick fact check TW.

The Blackwoods Brand you say has deteriorated under Distil. I beg to differ with your view. The Blackwoods brand is far more valuable now then when it was with the administrators.


Was Balckwoods in Asda, Sainsbury, Morrisons, Majetic Wine, Bookers before Distil took it on. Did the Small Bach Gin have TTB approval in the US; Or was it only sold in Scotland and limited distribution Northern Ireland.

How much debt was the Blackwoods company in before it went into receivership and BES bought the assets off of the administrators.

All public information and available for you to check.

I think you miss judge how difficult it is to run a company and make it a success. Where the company is now financially is a far stronger position than it has ever been. I am very happy to have that discussion on the board and we can analyse the accounts. I think that would be a far more constructive approach and mutually beneficial to all participants on this board.

Cash is king and is one of the aspects yourself and Boff keep referring to. Have you done any cash analysis, looked at asset turnover, debtor and creditor days etc..

I would point you towards that first off. You will see in all analysis the company has improved year on year. I do not have the figures to hand but am more than happy to open a discussion on it with you and have a balanced discussion.

[berny3] 26/2/2018 19:52

Just to make it clear neither Boff or TW hold any shares - but strangely do spend a lot of time and use a lot of words to say the same thing over and over.

TW is a good typer, possibly a freelance journalist. The quality of his arguments would stack up with that.

Are you good friends with Tim Warrillow?

Funny you don't seem to post much on the Fever Tree Board - any reason why your focus is to post on a board that you don't hold stock in and the company you hold praise for you don't seem to have ever made any posts on.

I am glad that you both (TW and Boff) here to keep the balance in the discussion would be great if you could back your arguments up with facts then we could discuss the points in more detail.

Enjoy your busy evening...

[threadworm] 26/2/2018 19:32

The Blackwoods brand has, imo, deteriorated under DIS (BES) and they missed a trick with it.

Since acquiring the brand from Shetland, they've failed to seize on exactly what made it special....what made it stand out in the market place. Also, in the meantime, the whole Gin sector lit up and became seriously more competitive. (THAT'S what's happening to the Rum sector NOW.)

The new gin website is an absolute shocker (it's like an A-Level school project).

When they release something like that, yes, it does make me question judgement.

You wouldn't get Tim allowing the release of a site like that at Fever Tree.

And anyone shelving all the blame onto Ambler from earlier years should take note of that new site and ask if much has changed.

Busy evening ahead...

Regards.

[threadworm] 26/2/2018 19:21

"I'm really not all that bearish, and I still think Redleg has the potential to do well. Its the blinkered optimism of some posters that irks"

Completely agree with that.

Blinkered, green, optimism - those who are happy to shout someone off the thread who actually had the admission document and talked to the company 15 years ago.

[threadworm] 26/2/2018 19:19

15 years on AIM and only achieving circa 25K cases a year across all 5 or so brands.

That's dramatic underperformance.

If you think that's good, that's your prerogative.

(Some companies have formed, marketed and exited in this time and created cracking brands in the process). And don't play the 'long game' card with me and about building LT value. 25K sales is all you need to know.....that and the CEO himself referring to one of his brands as 'tired'.

If Redleg wants to achieve proper traction it will need extra marketing spend. It's the nature of the beast. The sector is highly, highly competitive. Setting up a few pop up Rum Shacks at festivals last year was a good idea and effective but it wont be enough on its own. You need to remain relevant, interesting, on the pulse. If you are not, there are many other brands which will grab the taste of the target market and pull back any share you might have had. To remain at the front requires imagination, tenacity, a 'hotline' to the target market and....yes....cash.....and ideally plenty of it at this stage as the brand tries to secure its foothold.

Age at BOD level can bring experience, wisdom, contacts and an in depth knowledge of the market place. I agree with that. But an element of youth would not go amiss at this company, a company whose target market is significantly younger than the ceo. Experience and youth can be a potent combination. See Fever Tree as a good example. I've met with that BOD. The personnel overlap there very well and there is a well rounded view of the market and how to engage with the market.

DG's salary can not be compared to any AIM benchmark as salaries in this area vary wildly. It's foolish and a non argument to try to draw comparisons. I know some directors who are on over £400K and some who are on under £50k PA.

I think the point is, DG's salary is higher than it could be for a company that has, under his tenure, failed to turn in a decent profit. Anyway Boffster raised the issue of his salary, not me. It's not especially a gripe of mine. It's not an obscene salary....but one should be mindful that under his management the company has been reliant on fund raising. As such, a salary well under £100K would be more appropriate in my opinion.

Cash is falling at the business (see past RNSs) and you should EXPECT it to; Redleg needs supporting at this crucial time.

So. Expect another placing.

20% growth would be good for an established brand with proven market share, but it's not so great for a brand at this young stage and growing off such a small base. Remember, Redleg has been in the market now for 6 years or so.

25k case sales across all brands is poor....let alone for a company floated 15 years ago.

Still if you're happy with progress, that's fine, you're happy with it.

That's your own concern.

[berny3] 26/2/2018 17:10

Back on it Boff

Couple of things. Age brings experience and contacts in the drinks business that is far more important than young and reckless. I think you need to be careful in calling people aged and making wild statements about how much longer they are to serve.

I disagree with cash values falling. Quite the opposite in fact do some cash flow analysis. I have in the past put some figures together for you on this which I put up for you at the time.

You have not answered my question about average directors salaries on AIM companies. For you to have a view on DG's salary you must be aware of the average salary.

Are you aware of the liabilities that a director of a listed company has on AIM?

You quote your own age as being young. I refer to my first paragraph, age brings experience and knowledge. Youth is usually full of ideas but extremely inefficient. Like a spinning wheel that has not yet made contact with the ground!

[boffster] 26/2/2018 16:53

Berny, I don't claim to be Warren Buffet. but:

I know we have a barely profitable company which has never succeeded in making any money but is still valued at £~8m, despite shedding half its market value since summer.

I know it has not broken into the US in any significant way, despite promises of placing proceeds being used to achieve this.

I know that cash balances have been consistently dropping, presumably due to increasing amounts being tied up.

I know we have an aging chief exec who will likely stand down soon, is very handsomely paid and has pocketed a not insignificant amount of the placing proceeds in recent years, despite having not participated in one, far as I can see, since his maiden purchase back in 2013. Admittedly that was for a reasonably handsome 10m shares.

I know that as a youngish drinker, the Blackwoods bottle does not appeal to me one jot, and looks to me like something an old queen would drink.

I know I still can't order RedLeg from ASDA! :o)

I'm really not all that bearish, and I still think Redleg has the potential to do well. Its the blinkered optimism of some posters that irks.

[threadworm] 26/2/2018 16:27

You shouldn't be so self deprecating, Rodders. Keep your chin up.

[suneday] 26/2/2018 11:11

Old story. If you can't talk it up, you talk it down and try for another run later.

[onedayrodders] 26/2/2018 10:44

wow ..can you imagine having enough time on your hands to spend in a chatroom you have no direct financial interest in. Literally posting 100's of messages.

I'm sure that must fall under the definition of "sad"

;o)

[buoycat] 26/2/2018 10:03

Distil has survived 15 years, can be taken as a positive I guess. Getting red leg and Blackwood's into all the major supermarkets is a major advance. It's up to the consumers now. If the drinks and branding are good enough sales will follow. However Kraken rum is everywhere now and I think it has a stronger brand. I also think red leg at 37.5% rather than 40% is not going to help.

[berny3] 26/2/2018 09:46

TW - All I ask is for you to support your rants with figures. To maintain a coherent debate. You and Boff (possibly the same) have been unable to do that.

You think there will be a raising in April, but don't give anything to support that claim.

Why April?
What is the cash position?
What is the cash burn you have calculated?
Is the company cashflow positive or negative?

Some of us on here are accountants, lawyers, business owners, investment analysts etc.

Statements need to be supported by facts not a Daily Mail sheet of headlines to attract attention and not supported.

Quite like the analogy of a Puffer Fish. Thank you

[threadworm] 26/2/2018 09:11

Expect a placing and dilution before end of April - in my opinion.

Others may not agree with that, and that's up to them. (I wont attack them for thinking the company doesn't need more money).

....But I predict that they will indeed need more money and that they will be asking the market for it before too long.

Either way we'll see.

Time will tell us who has the more sober thinking.

[berny3] 26/2/2018 06:57

Cheers Tony

[tonys8] 25/2/2018 22:45

Berny, I'd say it was a medium sized one. Sainsburys classify it as a superstore. Serves a market town population 12500.

[berny3] 25/2/2018 21:20

Tony interesting in your local Sainsbury. Is that a mini market one or a larger supermarket?

[tonys8] 25/2/2018 19:48

Blackwoods gin went on sale for the first time in our local small town Sainsburys. .. sold 7 bottles in the first 6 days, not bad going. The new bottle design is excellent and certainly stands out on the shelves.

[berny3] 25/2/2018 19:35

Boff you talk complete nonsense and clearly have no idea about the industry and where the company is in the industry. You also show a lack of understanding of basic financial understanding.

Tell us How much equity does DG have and how much is he entitled to through options? Let us know if you know the answer to that or are just blasting off negative statements for the sake of it.

Also what is the average directors salary for a Aim listed company. As you seem to spout further negative messages about a fat salary. Tell us how does it compare to the average? You must of looked to be making such statements.

[a_2_b] 25/2/2018 00:41

Well I guess you'll have to miss out on this one. Maybe they should of put some cobwebs on the bottles for that extra vintage rustic feel and to catch your disappointment that seems to fly about now and again.

[a_2_b] 23/2/2018 23:08

Did the faceted glass glimmer/eye catching? Certainly unique to all the others from speculation will see for myself tomorrow will pop down to my local

[monnow] 23/2/2018 21:02

Has a footnote I was in Hereford Sainsburys tonight and the new shaped bottles were stacked on the Gin shelves. They look really good,the glass as a slightly greenish tinge,to my eye anyway, the bottle held up really well standing alongside some of the other bespoke bottle designs.

[a_2_b] 23/2/2018 17:11

I have a funny feeling we will somehow. Good luck to whoever is in here, not that you really need it at all. Just a case of how long your willing to wait and sit about really. Roll on US news flow will be all up from these levels then on.

[monnow] 23/2/2018 16:23

Heres to you too a2b. Im sure we will have the last laugh.