Conviviality Share Discussion Threads

[orange1] 05/4/2018 17:15

So RussellYou are trying to tell us that your wife will be suicidal when she learns that you have increased your pension pot by 25% in four years?

[tradejunkie2] 05/4/2018 13:26

russell250, too much cash in one stock and too much speculative investing sorry to read about it.

[bullet ant] 05/4/2018 13:22

Surely it's about 3.3m+ by now, not 3m.

If you can't count how much you lost, why would anyone care if you lost, your fantasy amount?


Please stop wasting Oxygen.


BA
Stealing is good.

[stud-muffin] 05/4/2018 13:21

I have BA filtered.

Whatever he may say is unknown to me - Karma Mr Ant, karma.

Russel250 - cash in. A million is more than 99% of the population will ever have.

Forget this game - it brings wealth to some but losses to most.

Genuine advice.

[russell250] 05/4/2018 12:57

BA

I am a full time investor

I had to give up work at 51 due to ill health

i started with a 763k pension fund after 27 years working flat out

built that up to over 4 million by may of last year

been a disaster from there despite some success in bitcoin over dec/jan

i have lost over 3 million between hurricane energy , provident , carillion and lastly this

If you find that amusing - you are one sad individual

My wife was expecting to draw down money from this july when I am 55 - i haven't told her re recent losses over last year - she will be suicidal

[russell250] 05/4/2018 12:38

This whole saga stinks - and requires a full investigation

I have lost a lot of money with 337k of shares

But have friends who lost tens of thousands

The speed of demise is remarkable - where was the protection for the PI

The protection for non institutional investors is zero
investec continued to issue messages of confidence without any due diligence
KPMG did not audit the half yr results (legally not required)
so the directors can say whatever they like

on the day prior to suspension still put out an rns - with £55.3-56.4 million expected range of ebitda profit

Investec did 2 updates to the city professional bodies not for pi eyes second on 12-3

Two major share holders sell their holdings
Old Mutual UK smaller companies
Downing Monthly Income
remarkable timing as
on 14th
Suspension
Rns re 30 million hmrc bill


the buying of shares by ceo/cfo after announcement on 8th march was a smoke screen in my eyes - and is a symptom of the fraudulent behaviour i believe has happened which a full investigation would uncover.

The mutual funds what remarkable timing to clear the positions - were they tipped off of 30 million hmrc bill in advance?

This needs a full investigation it makes the demise of carillion which was a protracted affair seem a much smaller cover up.

There is talk of a investor law suit against the directors but what could be recovered - peanuts -- add all bonus payments together - subtract legal fee`s divi out -- nothing much left


result private investors lose out

[sandy133] 05/4/2018 12:23

This is a real horror story.One might have had doubts about the company but some very fine fund managers were still putting money in late last year.These people will have asked most of the right questions, like cash flows ,debt buildup and sensitivity to a downturn.
I think that it is correct to surmise that they were given incorrect information.

The brokers to the company will also have done their own research, after all the Directors do not have to worry about things now, they have no job Investec have to keep their business running.After something like this it is hard for a broker to ring a client and say " I've got one for you".

As I have said before the Auditors /Accountants should have seen something wrong here, clearly the company was short of working capital even when the last accounts were signed.

[bullet ant] 05/4/2018 11:27

Hello my emates

I have survived the cold turkey.

I have discovered my inner self during the transition and have taking up OIL painting, and I am pretty good. I doing painting for aspiring glamour models, 34DD bra models, micro_G string bikini models, G-strings models, suspenders/ corset models and nudes one.

Poor Tsmith2, he's such an expert; a free advice from your KING, never touched whatever assjammer is pushing; it's guaranteed to be jinxed.


BA
Stealing is good.

[tsmith2] 05/4/2018 11:16

Utterly disgraceful

[tradejunkie2] 05/4/2018 09:37

Cest la vie.

Magners cider owner buys Conviviality

[w1ndjammer] 05/4/2018 09:13

electrick

could also be the straw that breaks the camels back !!

WJ.

[walbrock82] 05/4/2018 08:28

Investment Lesson

This is an important investment lesson, especially those people who got screwed by the management.
Never again, do you want to invest and see it go down the toilet!

To learn from any investment mistake, you need to revisit Conviviality. I did the same thing and spotted 11 red flags BEFORE management issued their first profits warning.

One red flag dealt is falling operating cash flow. That fell from £7.3m to £528k, a big signal that profits aren’t translated into cash flow. Another minor sign is the 10% decline in reported profit. Both these data signalled it would be nearly impossible for the company to achieve 14% growth in adjusted EBITDA, especially if its on a PE multiple of 30 times.

Overall, I concluded a company like Conviviality would sell off at the first sign of trouble because it was being hyped to the hilt! Any decline in earnings and cash flow would be the key signal to sell.

If you want to learn from your experience of Conviviality (scroll down to the article) or if you are interested in the other 10 red flags, then click

[electrick] 04/4/2018 19:10

Tiger
£102m of debt on repayment terms over 12 months. Absolute bargain.

News out of Hengrove... looks like full weekend shift to bring all up to date. All systems go.

Time to make some money on CCR

[electrick] 04/4/2018 18:17

“The Conviviality Direct businesses had gross revenues of GBP1,219 million and adjusted EBITDA of GBP51.3 million (pre central costs)(2) . Gross assets are approximately GBP230 million.“

£102mm of bank debt to be serviced over a 12 month period for a purchase of £1 ( nominal price paid) This looks like a bargain for C&C Group plc ... a little surprised the only saw an uplift of 11% in their share price today. Phenomenal impact on their revenues and as someone already pointed ou a company who it is hoped can gain synergies through a thorough review and application of integration with their business.

Of course they also pick up the employee liabilities and any cost savings may involve redundancies but it will be interesting to see over the next year whether it can be turned into a strong profit centre for CCR.

May have to have a tickle on CCR in the coming weeks

Presume the tax liability sits with CVR as no mention of this in the release.

Ugly for CVR. Great for CCR

[w1ndjammer] 04/4/2018 18:05

think someone added the £30 mill twice....

WJ.

[w1ndjammer] 04/4/2018 18:00

Yep here you go timed at 17.14 but not on ADVFN when i made my post at 17.16



WJ.

[castleford tiger] 04/4/2018 17:56

C&C paid £1 for both Matthew Clark and Bibendum but paid £102m in debt to its lenders. In other words, the lenders, not the shareholders got any value. So the purchase price is C&C paying £102m in enterprise value vs. £260m paid by Conviviality! Plus, C&C is a distributor and knows how to cut costs and find real synergy. I called it looking for bargains. Remember JD Sports follow the same strategies of buying low and creating value for their shareholders.

As for Conviviality, it is still responsible for £78m of debt and company size falls back to £400m-£450m level. And it still owes HMRC £30m. Make that £108m in liabilities.

couple of questions please

How have we got to 108 debt plus 102 =210 from a figure of 150 quoted by company?
This was quoted AFTER the 30m figure was given.

Who made the decision to sell at this price?
Why would you right off 150m off shareholder value.

Has this been announced on CVR YET?

Thanks Tiger

[augustusgloop] 04/4/2018 17:51

If those figures are correct - then this is an absolute disgrace that could easily have been avoided (or at least mitigated).