Burford Capital Share Discussion Threads

[rhomboid] 30/7/2019 11:07

It would inspire greater trust from non holders such as myself if I could see how much the CEO/CIO/CFO were paid...unless anyone can tell me another source for this information ?

putting them on the board would seem an obvious quick win in governance terms

[trident5] 30/7/2019 10:59

MF - why do you want him to be a director?

[mad foetus] 30/7/2019 10:43

I think it would be best all around if Bogart was made a director. He currently attends all board meetings, and I don't accept that it would be "unthinkable" for one of him and Molot to be a director but not both. He is the public face of the company and should be on the board. I don't see any downside

[trident5] 30/7/2019 10:17

Sounds like corporate BS though.

[galatea99] 30/7/2019 09:44

"The Rise Of The Commercially-Minded Legal Department"



In a word, legal departments become profit centres.
Burford enables this development.

[lomax99] 30/7/2019 08:11

Stockopedia has a foreword PE for BUR for FY 2020 of c 9.6, given a tendency to out perform forecasts this translates to sub 9.

[bulltradept] 30/7/2019 07:59

"bulltradept,re your post that' on an up day for the footsie,Burford is down mmmmm',it's the old 'there's no smoke without fire's argument.It's usually trundled out when the shorters having nothing left to say"

I don't short, I am looking for value though and given BUR is No.1 on Aim, I would have expected a bit more of a recovery in the price than currently has appeared.

Perhaps today? Good luck.

[5chipper] 30/7/2019 07:28

At least these comments perhaps offer a partial explanation as to the cause of the volatility

[jonwig] 30/7/2019 05:30

djd - confusing volatility with risk isn't the worst sin. If you're watching BBC news and someone says "Shares are volatile" they mean shares are going down.

[djderry] 30/7/2019 04:31

And so the wheel goes round and round.A student of the stock market could not but smile wryly.All the usual suspects are here.Selling at the bottom only to buy again at the top.Mixing up volatility and risk,thinking that one equals the other.Not knowing why ( or what) you bought in the first place and so being frightened out of your position.Fear and greed the emotional states that follow inexorably,one,then the other.Being susceptible to the rumour mill,letting others influence your long term investment horizons,thinking you're a long term investor only until the next dip in a share price...

[williamcooper104] 29/7/2019 21:55

MF - they are almost certainly making 8 figures I don't care It could be externally managed and we'd pay carry which would be the same Would rather be internally managed with high remuneration I've invested on and off with Barckley homes for years (not since brexit) - they rejected a take private offer and paid the management the same as PE would - management made hundreds of millions and shareholders got the PE returns

[nigwit] 29/7/2019 21:49

IC view

“In short, Burford’s business requires a lot of trust in management. How else do you swallow a boast of a $130m commitment with a global business “that goes well beyond anything seen in the market before”, faced no competition and yet would have been impossible for peers to manage? Recoveries and liquidity were strong here, and an earnings-based view of the shares still offers value. Buy.
Last IC View: Buy, 1,569p, 26 Jun 2019“

Source link and full story for subscribers

[mad foetus] 29/7/2019 21:17

Fundsmith is a beast and my biggest holding but I think rhomboid hits the nail on the head: the reason that Bogart, Molot and O'Connell are not on the board is so nobody is too how much they are paid. Usually it doesn't matter: the structure is essentially that of an offshore fund, and the fund would pay the manager a fixed percentage of AUM, and how they split it is their business. But BUR isn't a fund, it is using its own balance sheet, and it isn't right that we have no idea what sort of deal the three lead people are one.

[qruz] 29/7/2019 20:53

rar100, you are same as me you can check my previous posts, I've been in and out since late 2016, my first buy price was around ~575 but again been in and out the whole time. Between 2016, to mid 2018 i had fallen in love with the stock and couldn't see any negatives. Now it's currently not for me and sold out last week at 1620 going on my gut. Terry Smith knows the drill, my BUR proceeds are now in SSON which is ran by Terry, take a look.
GLA if you remain in BUR.

Just to add: Sentiment is a huge driver of the way the share price goes, it's now hugely negative, any news seems to reinforce this, by sending it lower.

The other item is just general capital protection, I'd rather bail and end up flat or make a few % for the rest of the year, than risk losing capital.

[rar100] 29/7/2019 20:12

qruz,

I have been invested with BUR for a long time and so I'm still in profit, but I'm now wondering if this is still a good investment, I'm not sophisticated enough to make a 'proper' reasoned judgement, but 20% down over a year tells me quite a lot. If I had just come across BUR as a possible investment, I wouldn't give it credence as there seems no obvious reason it's down (to me). So I would think that more savvy heads than me such as Cannacord and the shorters may be right, I just wouldn't take the chance and if I had bought recently I would have sold today. I'd think it was 'just too dodgy', another weird AIM stock. better to put the money in Fundsmith which is pretty easy to understand and is consistently doing very well.
That's not intended as a ramp, it's just a comparison for where to put spare money if one doesn't have a 5 year or more horizon - which I don't now.
And to me now it's just another weird AIM stock, never thought I'd think that way about BUR. I do now unfortunately.

[qruz] 29/7/2019 19:32

Agree with your comments rar100, personally I feel very relieved to not be invested here currently.

[rar100] 29/7/2019 19:17

I think there are many more advantages for BUR to be on a main market than to remain on AIM, the chart over the past year is chaotic, the share price action after last two results doesn't make any sense. It IS going to put off some institutions from investing.
It IS not good for their reputation as a serious legal entity I would think to have the gyrations in share price when valuation of the company is not a straightforward computation anyway - so much a traders share now open to shorters and tricks of brokers and false accusations like the Cannacord event.
With the chart looking as it does for the past year and the ever increasing rumour mill and market mayhem of AIM, it just doesn't seem a good move to stay on AIM for 'the leader in litigation funding'.
They are in a very serious business, the cap doesn't fit with 'anything goes' AIM.
Surely enough is enough....

[lomax99] 29/7/2019 19:08

Thanks. Press speculation today was for a December open following W's repositioning of the fund - just can't see it working, would the FCA allow it? Apologies OT.

[riverman77] 29/7/2019 18:57

Lomax99 - slightly off topic for this thread, but I think pretty much every investor will try and redeem and for that reason I don't think the fund will ever reopen. Instead, he'll have to do some sort of orderly wind down and gradually return money to investors, perhaps leaving the stuff he can't sell in a realisation fund.

[lomax99] 29/7/2019 18:50

So what % of Woodford holders are going to rush for the exit if he reopens the income fund in early December? A lot of angry holders, forced selling of BUR in December as everyone heads for the exit?

[rhomboid] 29/7/2019 18:47

Can anyone tell me what the the CEO CFO & CIO were paid last year..the AR doesn’t tell me as they are not directors

[minerve 2] 29/7/2019 18:33

EssentialInvestor29 Jul '19 - 12:48 - 6811 of 6841

Appreciate this is a rudimentary questions folks so apologies in advance -
why don't they just apply for a main LSE listing?.

Is there a good business reason against this?.






Cost and admin involved in a main list is greater than AIM. Corporate governance is much stricter. You sometimes see companies move from main list to AIM because of this.

If the stock is already liquid then the benefit might not be worth the cost.

I personally don't see a screaming benefit when you consider the negatives.

[dgdg1] 29/7/2019 18:19

For those who complain about Burford not moving to the main market, here's a quote from a Bloomberg article:"Shareholders used to expect companies to eventually move onto the “grown-up” main market. In fact, Harris says that 10 years ago, he would have been asking AIM companies that had grown sufficiently about whether it was time to consider transferring. These days, he doesn’t care which market they’re on. “It’s just not a conversation that ever comes up anymore,” he says." Article is at

[williamcooper104] 29/7/2019 18:15

I've got about 40 percent of my portfolio in US REITs - was actually quite concerned in March about a brexit deal getting done and GBP rebounding - not something I'm losing sleep over at moment :)