BNN Technology Share Discussion Threads

[perfect choice] 21/4/2017 07:15

Great appointments, fully ready for Nasdaq. Busy day today so will be reading annual report at weekend. Cash position clarified, £2M/month net cash burn stated for 1st 4 months so a good marker and clarification of cash and cash equivalents. That will do nicely for now.

[astralvision] 20/4/2017 13:06

It came out last April, although Mirabaud have issued the odd update here and there in response to news , but have not updated the main figures.
Various reports suggest a new note is underway. It would be understandable if perhaps they wanted to wait a few more months to get a better idea of how things are going, but brokers usually issue updates after the annual results. So I would estimate anytime from now onwards. Not sure how the Nasdaq listing may or may not interfere with that, I would have thought we would see a note sometime from now up to the Nasdaq listing.

[ssc85] 20/4/2017 13:00

When can we expect the broker's report roughly? Struggling to find the date for it last year as it was pre name change.

[astralvision] 20/4/2017 12:35

Fine PC, happy to let it rest till H1 2017 results. I guess those should be available before the Nasdaq listing.
I would agree and posted as such, top line growth is everything.

[perfect choice] 20/4/2017 12:20

We will have to agree to disagree then astral and wait for the H1 2017 results to see who is right. That figure you quoted from me is net of newer higher (compared to 2016)income generated in 2017 and excludes one time costs, be it cloud based services are opex based these days and the new student/credit initiatives will be developed by current resources (some headcount increase would be expected though I guess).

Focus now needs to be aligned to revenue generation and the cash burn will wither away in due course as a result

[astralvision] 20/4/2017 11:38

Genises
I certainly think the cash burn will continue at H2 levels for some time to come, as the further deals in the recent RNS will require funding, hence raising the £25m.
The cash burn could reduce in 2nd half if they get traction.
We will have a better idea of cash burn from the broker's report.
I'm not saying cash burn is everything,but it was in reply to PC's view of £1.3m a month, my view is that figure is too low.
BNN have got sufficient cash, I think top line traction is of equal or of more importance than the cash burn figure. I think we all accept companies at this stage will burn cash.
Re am I long or short?
Well, it shouldn't matter as these boards are for discussion and, as I have pointed out, it is factual that the cash burn for H2 2016 was around £3m/month, for whatever reason. The figure for this year is opinion.
I am not short, in fact I don't believe you can short BNN on IG Index, I may be wrong. But I believe in saying it how I see it.

[genises] 20/4/2017 11:25

Think you need to revisit the RNS as the company has one off payments which you have not deducted from your figures.which with out will make your figures lower.
Any one reading your posts will think the company is burning £3 million a month in 2017.
Which you dont know if is true or not.

I see you use the spread betting company IG Index
Are you long or short

[astralvision] 20/4/2017 11:09

Genises
I do my research, I was quoting £3m/month for H2 2016 based on the following:

cash end of H1 £7m, cash raised in 2nd half £40m. cash at end 2016, £28m.
therefore cash consumed 2nd half £19m, that figure would include the costs of the fund raisings, so an approximation of 2nd half cash burn would be around £3m.

That is not a figure 'plucked out of the sky'. I have no wish to 'shoot them down'.

The £3m/month approx. 2nd half is factual. It is unlikely to have changed too much so far this year, especially given Q1 figures.

Yes, I've also read the RNS that BNN put out. Let's see the traction. So far, it's not there.

[genises] 20/4/2017 10:56

Astralvision
Yet again you don't do your research and try to put doubt with figures plucked out of the sky.
Yea £3 million a month £36 million cash burn a year.
When someone provides facts you again try to shoot them down with your own.
Read all the RNS and do your own work.

In addition, we are in advance stages of negotiation on several significant contracts. These include contracts to support new B2C services launched on the Xinhua News Mobile App, working with prestigious national partners. Our technology will allow consumers in these sectors to make payments and update information with ease and security using their mobile phones. We are hopeful these services will go live in the first few months of 2017. Together with the contracts and initiatives announced today, these new revenue streams represent significant potential for both higher margins and valuable customer data.

What was your advatar before this one.
Strange how all these newbies come out of the closet just after lucien short letter.

[astralvision] 20/4/2017 10:20

Thanks PC, you make some good points although I'm still not convinced that the cash burn won't be substantially higher than your £1.4m/month.

We could bat it about all day long, but probably best to wait for brokers report.

Will just make 2 further comments:

1) Cash burn in 2nd half of 2016 is probably more representative of where BNN are now than taking the whole of 2016, so 2nd half 2016 it was around £3m/month

2) The Mirabaud report gave utility bill payments commission as 0.2%, you seem to be suggesting utility bills payments is higher than 0.2%.

'... to cover mobile tip-ups, utility bills and fines. the latter 2 having higher commission rates. '

If true, that is good news, but is there any basis of fact for that?

[perfect choice] 20/4/2017 10:09

H2 2016 revenues were £1.527M astral, think what you are forgetting about is the continuing land and "old digital" revenues BNN receive and continue to do so which are at higher margins. The mobile top-up is at 0.2% commission we understand but that is only a component of total revenues, so that commission rate should not be applied for all revenues therefore. The legacy revenues may well be a small proportion going forward (I've assumed flat for 2017) but a useful income earner in these times, where every source of income counts.

Also the initial platform launch was intended to cover mobile tip-ups, utility bills and fines. the latter 2 having higher commission rates. The question is whether all 3 or 2 or 1 items cover current revenues. That is one thing I want to find out myself.

Even if you strip out all the "old" item revenues, the average commission rate looks like 0.31% for the new "new digital" revenues and the GTV known in H2 (£269.5M). So on the new element there is more than mobile top ups involved to match the stated revenues.

The 2016 cash burn was £24M, its stated in the financial review. That will go up in due course across 2017 and I've accounted for that. With £413.4M GTV in Q1 2017, the gross cash burn may be higher but so is the revenue generation. All focus seems to be on cash burn not cash generation, so it is the net burn which is of interest to me right now. They have £45M cash right now as of April.

Back to work now so TTFN.

[astralvision] 20/4/2017 09:32

I think your monthly cash burn is too low PC.
The big question is what is the current blended commission rate? It would seem that only mobile phone top ups and possibly utility bill payments are currently active. The Mirabaud report gave a commission rate of 0.2% for both, so doesn't really matter on any possible split. The higher % traffic fines app seems not to have started yet.
So monthly commission rate is around 0.2% on , say, 140-150m, call it £300K.
Cash burn 2nd half last year was just under £3m/month. With all the new deals, I can't really see that dropping off. So, imo, cash burn is likely to be more like £2.5m+ per month. Least until traction on the deals becomes greater. That explains why they wanted/had to raise another £25m, the end of year cash was going out at a rate of knotts and as they wanted to set up further deals, new cash was needed.
The brokers report should give guidance on cash burn and % commission, so I look forwards to that.
The traffic fines app featured in a recent RNS and the annual reports, my take from reading those releases was the traffic fines app was not yet live.
I do feel a bit more clarity from the company on a whole host of issues may have helped prevent some of the recent volatility. They had set the markets up for believing everything was going swimmingly when, in fact, they had 'teething problems' and , despite many opportunities to inform investors, they took the opposite stance and declared everything was going flat out, in fact better than expected. It remains to be seen if lessons have been learnt.

[perfect choice] 20/4/2017 08:59

Well you lot were busy last night, don't you have another life!

Don't mind different views and PJ1 is entitled to question, but posting "garbage argument " counter statements just takes this BB to the garbage post layer anyway. I would also be wary of "wolf in sheep's clothing "characters on these free BBs (don't think PJ1 is that though, thinking of others on here).

Lets see what comes out of the annual report and AGM detail. Actually happy with BNN potential just not timescales for getting to it. Looking forward to H2 (July onwards then) when I can see the real action will start on new platform launches like motorist platform and Nasdaq listing which is happening. Few comments on cash burn yesterday including myself but nobody talked about net cash burn after income. I make that £1.3M per month on current declared GTV and starting from £45M cash pile right now. BNN have the time to work their revenues up with the more significant uplift being H2 now with new motorist and marketing revenues on top of progressive incremental mobile payment revenues. But a few information gaps I would like to pursue like what are the contributory elements to current revenues namely mobile, utility and parking fines - my suspicion is the last item is not in the current app and so not contributing to revenues right now but will be introduced in the motorist app in H2 (think I read a snippet buried somewhere indicating this in the annual results detail?). I will be contacting the company is due course and asking a few direct question like this to clarify.

[charlesdarcy] 20/4/2017 07:46

Genises ;

Yes this is very accurate , but also a weak link needs to be in the company so that the longs don't become too bullish in a urgent buy back .

And this is without doubt the situation with BNN .
There are some reluctant big players in this stock and in a way I don't blame them from buying in at this moment .

As the company need to show far more professionalism in communication with the investors and not expect them to pick up a story that had come to a dead end .

It is a long way from getting back to where it was , but as we all know the right sounds and then some support and this stock can be 50% higher than today's price in just 3 or 4 days .

Let's see where we go !

[genises] 20/4/2017 00:28

The short
market makers, hedge funds and others with the ability to short securities start by selling stock they do not own. After a substantial position is obtained.ie has enough money on the line they may even hire dubious writers to write propaganda on the company and then increase the trading tactics.

All this is designed for us to panic and sell our shares we bought much higher so the shorts can buy these shares back and cover the short position for a hefty profit. ie sell high buy low. They make the spread in the middle.

While this almost always works, when it fails it often fails for the shorts with disastrous consequences. The short squeeze starts, the stock runs way up, much higher then it did in the first place, and the broker make them buy back all the shares at any price. Meaning the shorts loose serious money. The long shareholders celebrate.

[genises] 19/4/2017 23:47

Student loans which banks will want to be the provider.
Can see a good partnership with a bank or two not just on the loans but also the data which banks are having a problem to attend as payments have gone from bank transactions to mobile payments.
Still think we will be taken out.

Traffic fines etc my understanding was a license was required.!!
Which wouldn't be achieved until 2017.
Some posters need to read past RNSes but hey ho they don't want to do the work.

[and11] 19/4/2017 22:57

Estoico, agree with your point, don't mind a reasonable argument for & against, just can't abide shorters!

[and11] 19/4/2017 22:53

Pj1! good try, but you don't fool me! Good luck with your short....you should have got out, this will turn soon...

[estoico] 19/4/2017 22:53

and11,

Bb's are for everyone to express an honest opinion on, not just for holders!!!

Bulls only threads dont work out too well normally.

If you want a bulls only thread you should email advfn and ask them to ban all the bearish posters, and see what their reply is!!!!!

And before you say it, I'm not short this stock!!

[pj 1] 19/4/2017 22:37

credock. Well called. Puts their 'perception' garbage argument straight out the window.

[credock] 19/4/2017 22:25

PJ1. Feel a bit sorry for you whatever your reasons for posting. Don't you know you cant go against the experts on this board ???. I got absolutely slaughtered a few weeks ago for saying everyone would get back in here soon at about 90p when it was £1.20 with the lack of news !. Never did I think we would see 68p.

[and11] 19/4/2017 22:21

Clearly you must have been bullied! bulletin boards tend to be for pi's to discuss vested interests in shares they hold!!! Please explain what your interest is?