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VIR Viridas

0.275
0.00 (0.00%)
28 Mar 2024 - Closed
Delayed by 15 minutes
Share Name Share Symbol Market Type Share ISIN Share Description
Viridas LSE:VIR London Ordinary Share GB0001636918 ORD 0.1P
  Price Change % Change Share Price Bid Price Offer Price High Price Low Price Open Price Shares Traded Last Trade
  0.00 0.00% 0.275 - 0.00 00:00:00
Industry Sector Turnover Profit EPS - Basic PE Ratio Market Cap
0 0 N/A 0

Viridas Share Discussion Threads

Showing 1976 to 1994 of 2150 messages
Chat Pages: 86  85  84  83  82  81  80  79  78  77  76  75  Older
DateSubjectAuthorDiscuss
13/5/2012
17:48
marab, your investing policy and returns are of course much more in line with VIR's no doubt than mine. I take a slightly more aggressive position. Your policy, in the long run, will always produce better returns than mine. Agree with you that near term producing assets should take precedence as a general principle, but even then things can go very wrong with small juniors trying to make the transition eg RRR Ascot mining, NVTA, HMB, EMED, NGL; on the other hand just look what's going on at WAFM, nothing more than some positive aerial magnetic survey results (I think sorry if wrong) and the mcap has gone to over £100m . I think the old rule hold's good: each investment must be looked at and assessed on its own merits. POLO recently changed its investing policy (to include oil) and are invested in some very early exploration plays, in oil and base metals.
I also get the feeling that messrs NL BR etc may be trying to build a investing company akin to POLO resources where JM SD NH have made a great success returning millions to shareholders. If we can do the same here in say 2-3 years our mcap would be many multiples of where we are now. And why not. All imho of course

xcap
13/5/2012
10:41
xcap - the PPA investment came as a total surprise as many here posted at the time. The size of the investment could be for a number of reasons. It might be that VIR took up the balance of the amount being raised and couldn't invest any more. It could be that there was enough downside risk that VIR limited its amount of investment accordingly.

There is a third reason that has nothing to do with money. Bruce Rowan, Nicholas Lee and a few others, invest in small AIM companies and we have seen stocks in the past jump simply because a certain investor got involved. I would think that is a fairly exclusive club to get into, and once in it may be necessary to help out fellow members when required. It could be that the investment in PPA was tactical in order to be able to invest in future joint projects.

Stake size and spreading risk might be factors as well. The bigger the stake in a company the harder to get rid of at a good price (we were pretty lucky with LDP - or well informed). Putting all your cash in one stock is always dangerous so how many companies is a reasonable spread 5, 10 ? Put all your money into one stock that doubles and life is wonderful, put it all in a company that flies like a brick and then gets suspended for years not so good. Also there is the simple fact that if you invest all your cash you can't invest in anything new without selling some of your investments or raising more cash (and I would not want to see a placing at these levels as us small PIs would more than likely not be includ4ed).

A 50% return on £150,000 could go a long way toward covering VIR's running costs for a year so perhaps not a total waste of time. Personally I would be delighted if I averaged 50% per investment, or at the moment, 5%.

The PPA investment has yet to prove itself one way or the other, although various posts on the PPA thread give an impression of a company about to move up a gear. Certainly we know that VIR would have had a lot more information made available to them than we will ever see.

I personally don't invest in Oil and Gas companies ( except TXO which has other assets), but the best time to invest in any company imo is when they are about to produce revenue after a period of time that has seen the share price slump far below NAV. The risk is greatly reduced at that point yet the companies need for capital often means a heavily discounted placing. Look at the STGR investment in Graphmada as an example. I believe that our Mr Lee has the contacts to find such companies and that's what I am betting on here. The placing that started everything off here was at 0.25p followed by another at 0.4p (from memory - might be wrong), so that means at the current share price we are getting in pretty cheaply compared to the normal vehicles for our investors here. Which is no guarantee that the share price won't drop further of course.

I also note that the share holders list on the company website is out of date and in breach of AIM regs and I will take steps to get that updated.

marab
12/5/2012
17:54
I was checking out the PPA website, and you may well be right marab, it may well be at a turning point
but even with a 50% return £150,000, simply not worth the hassle. i still think its a strange decision, unless, of course, NL (and the other 2 significant shareholders) know that there is a bid coming through in the next 3 months now that the share structure has been tided up and the balance sheet is relatively strong
As an investment company, with the depth of experience it has at its disposal, they must surely be looking for 2 or 3 x return, within 12-18 months timeframe, and that has to be in oil and gas sector
imho

xcap
12/5/2012
14:28
Marab.got some nice stocks with potential.abh..viy..gas..bzt..sgz..sac..Ppa.abtx..tstr. Srsp got another few on watch. I treat bulletin boards like a bee treats flowers picking out the good posts trying to glean as much imfo as possible an disregardingtherest.
bronislav
12/5/2012
13:58
Bronislav - might be worth making a list of stocks you would like to buy cheaper and seeing what the summer brings. Keeping some cash back is actually a lot harder than you think it is as you watch stocks drop day by day, but it never hurts to have some just in case that bargain appears.

Should also have said - don't take anyone's advice on a BB ;)

marab
12/5/2012
12:26
Thanks marab.
bronislav
12/5/2012
12:06
Bronislav - if you are still happy with the prospects here, and depending on what percentage of your cash you have already put in here, have a look at whether or not it's worth averaging down. I know a lot of people won't average down at all, but if the story is the same and the only thing that has changed is the share price then I think it's worth at least considering. The share price at the moment is 2/3 the value of the cash in the company alone with the other investments for free, and that's not a bad investment scenario. As I keep saying, check the graphs for AIM and the FTSE over the last few years and note the high and low spots. Better to buy in the sales than the Christmas rush.
marab
12/5/2012
12:00
My regret....didn't sell at .6-.7 and buy back now.another lesson that I will learn from .hopefully.lol
bronislav
12/5/2012
11:53
xcap - lot of us are like Bronislav, we are invested and we are quietly waiting for the next bit of news. I like the fact that the directors haven't just rushed out to spend the cash, but are taking there time to decide their next investment. I look at it from the point of view that some AIM companies have recently had deeply discounted placings of up to a 50% discount to the share price at the time . Now while that sucks if you hold the shares, it's a lot better if you are involved in the placing and know where the company is heading, and that is why it makes more sense to be in VIR than the target companies.

We are seeing cheaper and cheaper SPs on most AIM stocks, often on good sound companies that have just been caught up in the general flight to safety (a bank account paying nothing pence in interest and inflation running about 5% per year). Those good companies are watching their share price fall and some of them need money to upscale or otherwise move forward. Banks don't want to lend, even to each other, so where is the money coming from? VIR have £3m in the bank and can make cash available as soon as needed as xcap mentioned earlier.

I hold a lot of stocks that worry me because at any moment they might issue the dreaded placing RNS, but I hold this one because it's on the flip side - the one taking part in the placings. And its trading at a large discount to its largest asset - cash. I'm looking at a few stocks that have dropped way below fair value for their assets (and own many of them ;( ) and am toying with buying more. The directors of VIR must be doing the same but looking at buying in at prices far below those that I will get on AIM. Barring unforeseen circumstances I would expect AIM generally to drift down over the next few months as it usually does, so I am holding back a bit of cash for better bargains at that time, so I am quite happy for the directors here to be doing the same.

The above was a bit wordy but the summary is basically that this company has cash as its main asset with a history of doing well with its investments, and the price of buying into that cash is going down every week. The share price is going down but the cash asset remains the same, logically is that a reason to sell VIR?

marab
12/5/2012
07:08
Still here and being patient.
bronislav
12/5/2012
00:30
marab, there must surely be more than the two of us invested here :-)
anyone else out there, or have you all sold out, bit worrying :-(

xcap
11/5/2012
20:30
xcap - touche! A lot of good investors split the amount they want to invest into a stock and buy in 4 or 5 lots, but I lack the patience for it though I am trying. Lack of news here might give a good opportunity to average down, although to be fair, it's not a bad price now anyway.I'd love to know what projects they are looking at now and, having cash in the bank, I would guess that opportunities are coming to them on a regular basis. Timing the top and bottom has never been my strong point, but if I can get in lower than I sell that's close enough for me. Like STGR, this could be a good investment given time and happy enough to wait and see what happens next.
marab
11/5/2012
20:19
Marab, i was going to edit my post 1159 to say that oil and gas are of course natural resources, so they should fall nicely within the investment criteria

As for the buying in price of the share here, i could say the same to you over at STGR :-)
as you say one can never time the enter point perfectly, and there is always the fall back of averaging down, which I may do here.

xcap
11/5/2012
20:09
xcap - I'm pretty sure that our directors will be able to stretch the definition of natural resources sector to cover any future investment. Natural resources could cover timber, fish farming, etc etc. Personally I don't really care what they invest in as long as they keep making good profits on it, and preferably sooner rather than later. The first two investments were brilliant, the third has yet to prove itself, so maybe a stock to hold for the longer term. I would feel even happier about it if I had bought at the same price you did but that's life, and if I double my money here I certainly won't mind you trebling yours :)
marab
11/5/2012
13:41
xcap - 'The Company's proposed new investing policy will be to seek to identify further ways to create value for Shareholders through acquisitions in the natural resources sector.' Quite a wide field to choose from, and I totally agree with your 2nd paragraph. Cash is going to be even harder for some companies to raise, yet here we have a pile of it ready to go. If our directors can't squeeze out a good deal or two over the next few months I will be very surprised.
marab
11/5/2012
13:34
your post 1156 about sums it up Marab, particularly para 2.

ZOL, BRDY & VIR are all linked with some from of cross holding and Directorships. I bought VIR because I think in these turbulent markets, when banks are not interested in lending, cash is going to king. With a keen eye for a deal and an astute board and even more astute significant shareholder(s) (ZOL/Rowen) I think we will be able to strike a excellent price when the right deal comes along or by pulling the rug from another party due to our ability to act bloody quickly because (1) we will be cash buyers/investors and (2) shareholder approval will be fast because the there are only 2/3 significant holders whose nod will be required (who are also very experienced as investors in the resource sector).

Another thought: ZOL I gather have RAbromobvich's son involved? I wonder if we should be restricting our reach only to the resource sector and why we shouldn't extend to oil. Plenty of inside expertise and knowledge to tap into via ZOL (and LDP where we still hold warrants?). There may be a conflict with ZOL if they are actively pursuing the same commercial strategy, as I say just a thought.

xcap
11/5/2012
10:54
xcap - at the end of the day if more people want to sell than buy the share price goes down. Those that make the money buy when no-one else wants to buy then waits. As you said 'provided you have not bought a real dog in the first place', and here we have a stock valued at roughly 2/3 cash alone. Good example with BRDY, people are paying extra in the hope of a good deal, here the management has already done a couple of excellent deals and will hopefully do the same in the future, and we are trading at a large discount.

Funny thing about stocks, most people happy to pay twice the current share price 3 months ago won't be buying at this price ie. 50% off, yet the only thing that has really changed is the share price Look at yearly graphs for most stocks on the markets and see where the highs and lows tend to be. Difficult to see the possibility of a placing here at the moment, and even if all the investments dropped to zero value we would still be left with about £1.50 in cash for every £1's worth of shares.

I wouldn't advise anyone to buy or sell this stock, but I would advise them to have a look at what they would be buying here and then compare that to other AIM stocks, then work out the best place to put your cash.

marab
11/5/2012
10:17
quite a lot of downward pressure on share price here
xcap
10/5/2012
12:00
xcap - PPA being a dog is a pretty widely held belief and I think that may well have something to do with the share price drop here, but the investment was less than 10% of VIR's cash. It doesn't look the best investment at the moment but the management here thought it was worth putting money into and they have a good record here so far so I am happy to give them the benefit of the doubt. I have a fair few of these but if they drop more I will add.
marab
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