Tyratech Share Discussion Threads

[gemferret] 10/8/2014 18:33

'Then there is the Novartis deal so anyone with half a brain can see they are not a one product company.'

So the half brain guys are Zac and Nick on tips TV who interviewed Alan Reade thinking Tyratech was a one trick pony.

If you speak to Eden research they will say "nah, Tyratech have cut corners and our products are superior and will bite them on the bum".

Personally I think with Eden it's sour grapes, as they haven't got past regulatory points yet.

I assume everyone knows about Eden research natural products and their licence deals with a similar head lice treatment plus other products in the same sectors.

So in the 'market' it's best to have the correct information rather than put blinkers on over one product.

Tyratech are up against Eden research. I suspect that's part of the reason why they have raced to get Vamousse on the shelves by their own means, rather than risk Eden getting first mover advantage. Get it on the shelves, get the product recognition and secure first mover advantage.

Eden will throw as much dirt as they can at Tyratech behind the scenes.

I'm impressed with the tyratech position, that's why I looked in the first place.

They have gone for their own product launch, with a big partner it could have taken years.

I very much like what they are doing, I like the prospects a lot.

24% of the company with Amvac and that partner linked to a defunct brand product, has me on the back foot.

I think under the circs, as I see them, it's a good idea to find out what is going on.

I only invest in the AIM.

[nobbygnome] 10/8/2014 16:19

Gem

A company like TYR is clearly a bit too risky for you ;o)

Vamousse is where the biggest commercial opportunity is which is why they are concentrating on that at present. The insect repellent products are coming very soon but will never be so big. Then there is the Novartis deal so anyone with half a brain can see they are not a one product company.

With small cap companies, if you wait for all risk to be removed, it will be far too late. They are small cap for a reason and it is all about risk/reward.

So it might be a good idea for you to stick to FTSE100 companies...... there is less risk and more visibility there.....

And before everyone gets upset that is very much with tongue in cheek!

Nobby

[ga11amar] 10/8/2014 16:13

Novartis have some advertising on the internet. i think the pest control products will do very well con commercial basis as these are big problems for them. the retail not so sure

[ga11amar] 10/8/2014 16:10

I think gem is objective, I have found reviews for products that can no longer be purchased

we are not de ramping, just sharing

[ga11amar] 10/8/2014 16:07

u can find terminix product in Walmart website

[gemferret] 10/8/2014 15:46

Envance Technologies, LLC ("Envance"), the business enterprise that TyraTech formed in 2012 with AMVAC Chemical Corporation ("AMVAC"), continues to expand its commercialisation of non-toxic consumer pesticide products with major USA retailers.

Those major retailers obviously included walmart.

I'll wait for the response from the company if they reply.

Amvac hold 24%, all no doubt based on the Terminix/Envance JV where they sell the products under the Terminix brand.

Amvac have 10 mill shares in warrants to, I haven't looked up the relevant price re those and details.

Obviously no one that has read here yet seems to have a good idea re the Terminix situation, so I'll wait for the company to respond.

If I'm right, the main folk know, but most investors don't.

[michaelsadvfn] 10/8/2014 15:21

Walmart don't even list the other products. Flying insect spray is the one I thought would sell the best. Stinging insect is niche nest control so I expect that to sell the least.

To me it looks like Homestore and Walmart are just offloading what they have left.

There was never any agreement with Walmart to sell any of their other products. Tyratech approached them to sell Vamousse, that's all.

[gemferret] 10/8/2014 15:08

yes I get the Nit mousse brilliant stuff, I would imagine it will sell very well.

Have you checked Vamousse V Rid and Nix in the trial ??

The Novartis deal is huge too as that will go worldwide.

The market does not like one product companies, so if all you do is go on about nits, you turn the focus to one product.

Then the Eden research lot tell you how their product will nail Vamousee and so on.

Fat chance imo, I've never heard of 2nd mover advantage and they are way behind and way off launch.

The whole reason in my opinion that this is a £20 mill MC company is because very few understand it.

If the understanding is that low, then if Terminix is dead, many may think Amvac will dump their shares and we all know what happens then.

I'm talking about investor behaviour, the AIM, and the market, not the value of the products or company, those can be entirely separate matters and miles apart.

So it's best to have the full picture out there, so such news, is not news, to those that matter.

If the Terminix brand is to remain and Natunex with the same products then all well and good. With the terminix brand power, I doubt the deal included allowing Tyratech to pump it out through anyone else they fancied selling it through under other brand names.

I personally would like the point cleared up, and if there is to be news on those lines, to see the market reaction. Then some indicator as to what is to happen to Amvac's holding.

Rather than guess I would like to know. If amvac dump then take it down then fine, if they are staying, great.

It's the uncertainly I want cleared out of the way.

[gekko68] 10/8/2014 14:43

Why does everyone keep going on about the joint ventures which they had with other drug companies? Need to look at the bigger picture here. Its the deals they do with the retailers that count & the revenue that will generate. The deal with walmart was a huge one & they are not sharing that revenue with anyone. There head-lice product was number 3 out of 15 products for sale at walmart & that was only after 3 months. The competition are almost non existent when it comes to organic products,which are not only %100 affective but also %100 safe.

[gemferret] 10/8/2014 13:56

Just found this (envance site)

hxxp://terminixproducts.com/contact-us/where-to-buy/

Search new York (30 miles) for the stinging insect killer via the envance site

Then change to the more popular kitchen insect and flying insect options.

The stores drop from 25 to 5 and none in down town new York at all.

Selling well, or more likely (following research) discontinued.

Change locations you will see the same happens.

[gemferret] 10/8/2014 13:44

Yes that's exactly what I'm saying. The Terminix deal in any form is dying or dead and products under that name will cease to exist.

Yes I'm aware it was a brand licencing deal

Why

Because I did my DD.

EG

your comment

'Novartis are not selling Terminix type products. Terminix was for termites and homes. Novartis is for flies and cattle sheds etc.'

hxxp://www.petwellness.com/livestock/cattle-natunex.shtml

All the products under terminix are listed on the Novartis website under the new product name Natunex.

Hence I made phone calls, as I couldn't see that the two brands under the same product going head to head. Plus if terminix was on sale and then sales are not impressive.

The Terminix brand had all those products listed. Now they are shown under natunex, all of them.

It seems to me Tyra have given up on Terminix and gone to Novartis. It seemed very clear to me re ums ers and dormant that the terminix side of things is dead or dying, and we have yet to be informed.

Terminix brand deal leads to Amvac/Tyra, 60/40 JV leads to envance terminix. amvac hold 24% of the shares in Tyra.

I am not kicking up a fuss here, I am just sharing what I have found, what I have been told, and what I believe is going on.

I have tried Walmart and searched terminix. The only relevant product they have is the stinging insect one and it says in limited stores

Homestore

Checked them too

It seems only crawling and stinging insect listed.

I note some of Terminix products are showing as discontinued.

My conclusion is having had conversations post research, that the Terminix deal is at best inactive.

The whole lot seems to have gone over to Natunex.

Walmart don't even list the other products. Flying insect spray is the one I thought would sell the best. Stinging insect is niche nest control so I expect that to sell the least.

To me it looks like Homestore and Walmart are just offloading what they have left.

I have no problem with Novartis taking the lead, it all sounds great, but you guys and obviously everyone else seems oblivious to the potential that the Terminix deal is not as it seems.

[sidam] 10/8/2014 12:36

GF
I am not sure what you mean by the Terminix deal is off. Can you explain?

Are you saying that the AMVAC JV is dead?

Or that the JV no longer sells under the Terminix brand name.

Or are you talking about the original deal under which Terminix gave the product to their customers has ended?

If the last, that is not news. It occurred two years ago and was announced at the time.

Novartis are not selling Terminix type products. Terminix was for termites and homes. Novartis is for flies and cattle sheds etc.

[gemferret] 10/8/2014 12:21

I'm not guessing the quote is 'the Terminix deal is Dormant' I've given up up the nomad who seems to know nothing about what products they do and emailed the company.

Try Walmart all they have left listed is the stinging insect product.

The bigger picture is not a problem, I am a fan of the share. BUT my concern (I'm allowed to have one) is the impact of the market becoming aware that a deal with the biggest pesticide brand name in the world has ended.

The 'market' will think of many reasons why that deal failed, and that will include that it doesn't work (It does quite clearly).

Funds and major investors have very little clue what they are invested in.

I strongly believe the terminix is off. If true I want to see the market reaction to that news before getting involved.

I suggest that is a fair consideration to make. I don't see the market thinking an end of the terminix deal as good news.

Yes under the circs I think the Amvac position would simply end up in the hands of other funds.

I will let you know if I get a response. It is perfectly viable for them to contest my findings and say all is well.

[sidam] 10/8/2014 12:03

There seems to be some misunderstanding on Terminex, AMVAC and TYR. Some years ago, Terminex gave a TYR product to their customers in order to stop their technicians revisiting. At that time TYR did some owns sales via distributors. The deal with Terminex was cancelled, but TYR was allowed to sell under that brand name and a JV was formed with AMVAC in order to do so.

That JV is still working as far as I am aware. The products are available at Home Depot. Just visit the site and search for Terminex. AMVAC supply all the working capital and TYR will not get any cash benefit until the JV is profitable and AMVAC get their loans repaid.

I am not sure why there is any concern as the new Terminex agreement has not been cancelled and why there is any thought that AMVAC might sell.

[nobbygnome] 10/8/2014 10:38

The bottom line is that the upside here is much larger than the downside. After all you can only lose 100% but the upside is that there is a potential to multibag from here. That is a somewhat flippant comment but the endless agonising is essentially whether we are at the low point now.

I think most people here agree that the products are excellent and the company will succeed. Yes it may go down a bit more before it goes up a lot but as all us experienced investors know, perfect timing of purchases is very difficult. So if you believe in the products now is a good time to buy shares IMHO. We are on the verge of the breakthrough in sales with Vamousse in Walmart, Boots and Superdrug. Other chains and countries will follow.

So all this navel gazing is pointless; if you believe in the company and are interested in investing for more than 10 minutes, then this is an excellent entry point!

And if American Vanguard dispose of their stake it will almost inevitably be via a placing with institutions so I don't spend any time worrying about that! Some people just can't see the wood for the trees.......

GLA

Nobby

[gemferret] 09/8/2014 21:17

Have a read

hxxp://envancetech.com/

'Springboard into the US', world's biggest pest control brand etc etc.

party poppers for the big deal.

Money thrown at the JV 'Envance' (Amvac/Tyra)

It's sounding like it been terminixed.

Do I see the market as thinking that is good news ...... No.

Do I think it will affect the big picture.... No.

Will Amvac dump their 24% of the company.... No idea, but without further info, if terminix is dead, for now I have to assume they will.

Tyra are with Norvartis.

[gemferret] 09/8/2014 20:23

Perhaps I am misunderstood,

I think vamousse is fab and will sell like mad, it completely slaughters US similar products.

Here is my very heavy concern short term, It's not about investors that understand Tyratech, but those invested that don't.

A deal was done for the Terminix brand name.

Then Tyra linked with AMVAC, then came the 60/40 Envance. Envance deal with terminix.

Amvac took 29.46% of Tyratech.

The current shareholding is shown as .....American Vanguard Corp 24.09%.

Currently there in no public news saying the Terminix deal is dead.

So personally I would like to know officially that the Terminix deal has gone and then I want to know what investors reactions are going to be when they realise the AMVAC connection also has a track into Terminix via envance.

Will Amvac offload, or more importantly will investors sell thinking Amvac will offload as Tyra seem to have moved over to Novartis.

It's just a move, but Amvac have a large shareholding and I have no idea if they would exit if the terminix deal is off.

Fear is often more damaging than fact, so if terminix is off the table, then spell it out and what it means about the close association with Amvac.

Those terminix products now seem to be with Novartis.

I would like confirmation from the company what is going on, so I can consider if AMVAC will remain as a major shareholder, and how the market will react to such potential news.

[ga11amar] 09/8/2014 14:18

Tropicana did same thing with stevia...pure circles product

[ga11amar] 09/8/2014 14:16

Even if they dont make large sales they have marketing value to other companies.


They can sell a 5 pct deet product with 8hrs pritection by putting tyra in. People trust deet at low levels

[nobbygnome] 08/8/2014 21:42

That is most definitely the end game; I discussed it with the management. It is just a question of when........

Nobby

[gekko68] 08/8/2014 18:32

I agree with your point about there products being technically good. For over 50 years the only affective products on the market where chemical based & hazardous. The problem for the competition is,they don't have anything to compete with there products. If there products sell well & generate allot of income,then due to there market size they could become a takeover target.

[ga11amar] 08/8/2014 13:13

strictly they shoud not as its insider trading if they get price sensitive information

i think for them its small change and they dont want to get holding % diluted by not participation

i think all is good here. i have little stake , wait to see about more

[ga11amar] 08/8/2014 12:34

I won't really value the sales for the amount of sales, if that makes sense

if we get enough to make even an ok profit which allows them to bring more products without lots of fund raising i am happy.

i think their products are technically good but they probably have alot more value to a larger company with brandloyalty and existing sales networks.

Its the latter point which i see massive value in.

with good sales im happy to buy at 20% higher, its not a problem for me. THe higher price will be underpinned by the proven sales so it will be a good value.

[gekko68] 08/8/2014 11:45

My strategy is based on the what the institutions where willing to pay which was 7p. As we are around that level,i can see more potential upside than downside.
Sure sitting & waiting might be safer,but if sales figures are far better than expected,then there will never be another chance to buy at these levels.

[ga11amar] 08/8/2014 11:19

i think we fundamentally agree but have different approach

my plan is wait then buy, i guess yours is buy and wait