Tetragon Financial Share Discussion Threads

[humbugg] 09/10/2001 15:56

someone likes them. 25k buy just gone through.
H.

[llucky] 09/10/2001 15:40

Obvious de ramping is to be frowned upon but as the retail investor/trader is always the last to know I welcome comments and views, the charts tell their own story. The city speaks with forked tongue all the time. Only two weeks ago they were telling everyone to sell and head for the hills, now you notice they are saying this is the time to buy or you will miss the boat. I think they were/are doing the opposite!

I lost big time with the analysts ramping and a big city firm admitted to me recently that all last year whilst they were issuing strong buy notes on a lot of tech stocks they were actually underweight as a company. He was trying to impress me to gain business but I think it stinks. There is a seller in this stock, look out for the 't' trades. These do not have to be reported untill the order has been full unwound. Well, is that fair and right. No, it is not a level playing field.

I went short at 5.10 based on these sells and the chart.

[hjb] 09/10/2001 15:32

MTG - don't worry, I am pretty light. :)

I have been trading since 1987, so have never believed to be playing a level field. I did post on here to stimulate debate, nothing more.

I will repeat that I think shorting is a very valid tool of trading, that alone put's me in the same corner as certain so called unethical traders :)

"Talking down a stock is not illegal" - well that is a pretty bold statement, and I don't believe it to be true. If "talking down" involves false statements (de-ramping), or based on inside info then it is indeed illegal.

May I put it to the jury that the statement above "Other bb's have heard rumblings inside the company itself. See ya @ £3.50." is malicious at best and indicitive of market malipulation (illegal) at worse.

I am not niave enough not to believe that this doesn't go on all the time, I used to be taken in by this sort of stuff many years ago but now know better. I do think people acting on this stuff only have themselves to blame. IMHO only.

[m.t.glass] 09/10/2001 15:11

HJB - Talking down a stock is not illegal. Distasteful to some, and frowned on by many, but not illegal. No more of a crime than the house broker and others talking it up.

"..I see no good reason here to be shorting this share other than the fact that a number of other people are.."

Well, as long as there are enough of those 'other people' to create sufficient doubt for the price to fall, I am always pleased to collect any gain I can make from exploiting that movement. A very high proportion of share price movements in all stocks occur on spurious grounds, day in day out. Rumours and hints and disinformation are a regular part of how the market works, with much bigger players than the likes of us usually pulling the strings. Those of us here who've gone short on this one know the score. We can see how solid the case is or isn't and will limit exposure accordingly, knowing that if there's nothing in all this it will turn against us in a flash.

And the companies who float on the market, rather than raising funds in other ways, do so knowing it's a casino.

Lighten up. It's only a game (well, OK, maybe 'Dangerous Sports' rather than games) :O)

MTG

[tocsa] 09/10/2001 15:07

thanks mat

[timeliner] 09/10/2001 14:58

I also shorted this morning - purely on the chart breakdown.
Needless to say according to Sharescope the P/E seems a bit of the high side.

[tocsa] 09/10/2001 14:46

HJB no of co are overvalued,the board are holding info on few occasions re the state of the co.reseach by private investors is a must before shorting/going long

[matthewa] 09/10/2001 14:46

tosca & WLD and ITO are my favourites see seperate threads. I feel there is more downside in WLD as ITO has fallen over 50% since I first shorted it.

[big vern] 09/10/2001 14:46

HJB - I'm going on the charts - don't even know what this company does but to me the chart does not look good

regards

BV

[tocsa] 09/10/2001 14:39

closed my short on SENIOR today 25% down yesterday..17% down today.are you shorting any other cos.

[hjb] 09/10/2001 14:37

I hate to say that although I think shorting is a very valid way of trading shares (and I think I have argued the case for it on numerous threads) I think that this thread is very unpleasant.

I know nothing about this company, but I note that the last news from this company was very positive about prospects. The only new information here is that some bb's may or may not have some inside information. Matthewa - "Other bb's have heard rumblings inside the company itself". To summarise this must mean that some people are de-ramping, or have inside information and are looking to encourage others to trade. Both are illegal.

The information about St.Ives is also a red herring since their difficulties are specific to financial/corporate printing, and of course there has been little of that sort of business this year.

I see no good reason here to be shorting this share other than the fact that a number of people already are.

[big vern] 09/10/2001 14:30

Luverly job ......all in ??

hang on then

[tocsa] 09/10/2001 14:24

i am shorting this co.

[matthewa] 09/10/2001 10:12

Good to have you on board Big Vern

[matthewa] 09/10/2001 10:10

kenmill - pe ADVFN

[kenmill] 09/10/2001 10:06

just realised that you quote St Ives as being a direct competitor which shows you know nothing about TFG. St Ives is a security PRINTER and printer of magazines and books - TFG is a PUBLISHER of scientific books and journals - there is no comparison. TFG has a "must have " product for every college, university and research department around the world and is therefore almost recession proof. The June AGM statement was bullish and there are no problems in the company - so happy de-ramping - it will create a buying opportunity.

[big vern] 09/10/2001 09:46

Looking dire....

Short @ 488

[kenmill] 09/10/2001 09:24

Don't know where you get a p/e of 45. FT shows historical p/e of 27.8 and Company refs shows a forward p/e of 25.6. June agm quoted "continued organic growth with the efficiencies derived from integrating acquisitions should make 2001 another successful year, in line with our expectations" There is also the anticipation of further acquisitions that have occurred regularly before and after flotation so this begins to look like a de-ramp to me

[matthewa] 09/10/2001 09:01

DOwn 3.5% already looks like the cat is out the bag already.

[matthewa] 09/10/2001 08:58

DOwn 3.5% already looks like the cat is out the bag already.

[humbugg] 09/10/2001 08:53

short £4.98p
H.

[matthewa] 09/10/2001 08:52

Shortered this dog @ £5. Signifacnt downside on this one. Foward p/e of 45 - 50% above the rest of its sector. One of its competitors in its sectors St Ives (SIV) just p/w today. Chart looks dodgy. Other bb's have heard rumblings inside the company itself. See ya @ £3.50.

[matthewa] 09/10/2001 08:51

Shortered this dog @ £5. Signifacnt downside on this one. Foward p/e of 45 - 50% above the rest of its sector. One of its competitors in its sectors St Ives (SIV) just p/w today. Chart looks dodgy. Other bb's have heard rumblings inside the company itself. See ya @ £3.50.

[m.t.glass] 09/10/2001 00:20

Gone short on this one.

[llucky] 08/10/2001 17:53

This is what advfn says about 'T' trades which have been going through on TFG,
now you could argue they are buys, but if so why is the price falling ?

'T' If reporting a single protected transaction. A protected transaction occurs when a large order is going through the market. The buyer (or seller) may wish to keep the order anonymous from the rest of the market as the size of the order could greatly alter the price of the stock. With a protected transaction, the dealer will put the trade through in small quantities rather than knock the whole order out in one hit. The entire transaction is reported once the deal is completed. The LSE is notified at the start and at the end of the transaction. However, the market as a whole isn't told until the end, thus the order is protected.