Sabien Technology Share Discussion Threads

[pugugly] 15/3/2013 13:16

Masurenguy;> Thanks for that. Revenue and profit therefore dependent on gaining significant extra market penetration each year and limited (so far as one can see) replacement sales. Hummmmm;- Will have to recrunch the numbers and make some guesses as to what level of extra penetrstion they will be able to achieve - Key I suspect maybe new build rather than retrofit.

More digging needed or switch of areas with faster growth potential )?? Fuel cells but which coy and which technology -

A large number of graves down that road already, and more (I suspect) being dug at the monent.

[masurenguy] 15/3/2013 13:00

PUGUGLY - 294:Been trying to determin how much of their revenue is derived from ongoing maintenace contract but have not yet been able to determin. Anyone who has followed for a period able to direct me to this detail ?

This will range from negligible to zero at this point in time. MG2 has a 5 year warranty and actual sales only commenced 5 years ago and were fairly small - circa £600k in 2007 - at that stage. I've not investigated any potential future revenue expectation for post warranty service and maintenance but I would doubt that this would be of any real significance as a revenue stream.

Meanwhile the recent fall in the shareprice is based on negligible trading volume - circa 165K shares or just around 0.6% of the shares in issue - over the past 2 weeks, which just illustrates the illiquidity here.

[ansc] 15/3/2013 12:06

I don't know what game the Money Makers are playing (with the SNT sp) but the 12k sale this morning allowed me to buy another 15k @ 23.9p; now, for 15k, the ask is up at 25.5p. Very strange although I remember something similar happening in January last year (when I bought in 23.5p) before the price took off in March. Hoping the same thing will happen again this time albeit the action has been delayed by a couple of months!

[pugugly] 15/3/2013 10:51

Just dropped by to ahve a quick look due to the heavy fall.

Spread is horrible and looks rather illiquid

Jordan - Amanti still holding - 2.8% of their assets (Jan Fact sheet)


As of July 31st they were holding 1,339,660 shares. From recent rns's not sure what the implication is is respect of statment "change in issued capital" as no details given.

Looks like todays sell being absorbed.

Been trying to determin how much of their revenue is derived from ongoing maintenace contract but have not yet been able to determin. Anyone who has followed for a period able to direct me to this detail ?

Thanks in advance R.

[pj 1] 14/3/2013 08:28

I have managed to obtain more personal email address's following a call so will see what happens. Unless I am asked specifically not to I will gladly summarise any response

[seblufc] 13/3/2013 23:16

Pj in recent weeks I have found sabien to be quite prompt in replying to emails . Gus orchard I think is who has replied . Along the lines of trading in line with west house securities note but hope to release major news within the coming months

[ansc] 13/3/2013 19:35

Having stood on the sidelines for just over a year, bought back in today when the 'offer' dropped below my target price of 25p. Have always thought this to be an exciting company with future potential.

[cnx] 13/3/2013 01:12

it is important that directors of small companies return phone calls.

please let us know the results of your efforts

[pj 1] 12/3/2013 21:41

Mas fair comment maybe ''cutting my losses'' is a part of ''reviewing my position'' a better way to put it. ''Averaging down'' is still an option within that yes. Just to reiterate, i know they have a great product!

[masurenguy] 12/3/2013 18:17

I've never had any problem communicating with the company. I never send emails to any company where I am looking to establish some dialogue with them as an investor - I always phone and talk to the directors.

Who said there was no news due until October ? The company will announce any new significant orders or contracts when they receive them. They stated in last months interims that they are expecting a strong H2

"We anticipate delivering a full year trading performance in line with current market expectations with sales performance weighted towards the second half of the year. Historically, our sales performance has shown a tendency to be higher in the first half year than in the second. However for this financial year a higher proportion of our sales are scheduled to be delivered during the second half of the year. This pattern shift reflects the way that our sales pipeline is evolving.

Growth from new and existing business has created a solid platform for 2013. Taken together with the sales performance since 1 January 2013 and orders that we have been informed by our customers will be placed over the next few months, the Group is well positioned to take advantage of market opportunities.
We believe the current economic climate will continue to create significant medium and long-term growth opportunities for the Group, both in the UK and overseas. The Board feels confident that we will continue to build on our track record of sustainable profitable growth and therefore remains confident of meeting its expectations for this financial year." Interims on 12/02/2013

I doubt that anything has changed in the 4 weeks that have subsequently elapsed since the interims so the maschinations in the shareprice do not reflect anything that might impact the investment case. However sentiment is notoriously fickle and this can change for no particular reason other than boredom in some cases. Patience is always a requirement with small caps. This is a very illiquid stock and significant price movements can be triggered by small trading volumes. You must make your own judgement calls on what you buy, hold or sell but it seems a little odd that you are thinking of "cutting my losses here" when you only announced in post #282 a month ago that you were averaging down.

[pj 1] 12/3/2013 17:56

Mas, unreturned phone calls, no response to 2 emails (via the Site)

I am reviewing my position in this Company and wanted clarification from them as to what has happened to the large tenders they referred to in the x2 updates before the HY, where they were not mentioned. With no News due until Results in October how much further could this drift is my concern. Great product I accept but no market sentiment nor momentum. Jam tomorrow springs to mind.

Plus I have been lucky this year in other shares, thinking of cutting my losses here. Why did they not respond to Communications? Do they treat prospective Customers the same way. All these things springing to mind

[masurenguy] 12/3/2013 17:19

The link to their website is in the header and it provides telephone numbers and an email address.

Exactly what information are you after ? They only published their interims results a month ago and
as far as I am aware nothing has changed since then.

[pj 1] 12/3/2013 13:39

Does anyone have an email address for Alan O'Brien, or any other member of the Board
TIA

[pj 1] 19/2/2013 12:22

Emailed the Co last Thursday to try and get some clarification. To date not even an acknowledgement or ''cannot comment'' (any reply is better than none). Not impressed

[pj 1] 14/2/2013 15:41

Mas..

From 7th Feb 2012 HY

The size of the sales pipeline is a key performance indicator as it gives an indication of the level of business that could be generated over the following 6-24 months. Sabien's experience is that it can take at least 18 months for a customer enquiry to convert to a sales order.

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From HY 2013

Sabien's experience is that it can take between 6 to 18 months for a customer enquiry to convert to a sales order.

From enquiry to order (unsure of order to delivery time)

However as these are mainly Public Sector I suspect this delay is at the Customers end (Budget, Justification, Feasibility Studies etc. and not SNT 's process

I also suspect the shift in HY weighted orders is due to budgets being undertaken in Private Sector traditionally from October to December. Hence (hopefully) orders being placed in SNT HY 2 (I.E. first 6 months of 2013, 2014 etc) before budgets are spent before being amended or withdrawn.

If that is the case I feel much more confident SNT can hit expectations (although it does not look easy as it looks as if some orders have been delayed or cancelled, hopefully again delayed)

All IMO

[pj 1] 12/2/2013 16:31

Bitten the Bullet and averaged down!

Product is still excellent. Lets hope the Co can realise its Product

[masurenguy] 12/2/2013 15:59

PJ 1: As they state the process from enquiry to delivery is 18 months have SNT reduced to ensure delivery? I can only conclude they have lost significant sales pipeline due to non- delivery (e.g Customers not prepared to wait 3 years?). Especially as SNT seem to hold Quality (of which delivery is a measure)of paramount importance. How does the ''indirect'' sales fit in, is it SNT who have not delivered or an indirect partner?

There is not an 18 month timeframe from order to delivery. That timescale relates to conversion of a qualified quotation to actual order and/or scheduled delivery to the customer. They haven't lost any business to my knowledge, as a result of elongated delivery schedules from SNT to the end user either directly or via third party installation.

Indirect sales represents business transacted through a third party distributor such as Balfour Beatty, Serco or British Gas, as distinct from Sabien dealing direct with the end user. This has always been part
of their strategy as the product became established and the business grew.

qvg - mine was an extra 30%

A good opportunity to top up in my view when the share price is as low as it is today !

[qvg] 12/2/2013 15:00

Mas, mine was an extra 30%. but I guess my holding is probably smaller than yours

[pj 1] 12/2/2013 13:22

OK for discussion- No Ramp or de-ramping intended.

Sales Pipeline increased from June 10 £3.2m to 6.3m to date = £3.1m plus Sales of £ 5.502m = £8.602m
Sales of £5.502m = 63% Conversion rate from Sales Pipeline?

£6.3m x 63% = £4.0m

4.0 / 2.7 (estimated turnover) = 1.5 (i.e. 18 months?)

As they state the process from enquiry to delivery is 18 months have SNT reduced to ensure delivery? If that is the case I can only conclude they have lost significant sales pipeline due to non- delivery (e.g Customers not prepared to wait 3 years?). Especially as SNT seem to hold Quality (of which delivery is a measure)of paramount importance.

How does the ''indirect'' sales fit in, is it SNT who have not delivered or an indirect partner?

Thoughts please or a load of Tosh?

[masurenguy] 12/2/2013 12:55

"Investors were not persuaded by assurances that full-year trading would be in line with market expectations and exited the stock"

Really - well with a total volume of shares traded of circa 450,000 - around 1.4% of the shares in issue (and around a third of these are buys) - that seems to be a typical piece of gross media exaggeration.
Not only do I remain an investor here but, like qvg, I have also taken advantage of todays price drop
to add another 10% to my existing shareholding.

[joesoap3] 12/2/2013 12:54

MAS, Re Amati holding.

I hadnt fully realised the implication of the first annuncement by Amati and thought it was their complete holding that had been reduced. I only relaised my error when I read RNS number 2 today.

Thanks for pointing it out.

I must admit I did go to sell this morning but could only get 30p and I wasnt going to sell for that. I was very disappointed with the results but hope that it will steady and recover once people digest the full situation

[pj 1] 12/2/2013 12:13

Boiler energy efficiency specialist Sabien Technology (SNT:AIM) swung to a £67,000 loss for the six months to 31 December compared with a pre-tax profit of £301,000 loss a year ago. Investors were not persuaded by assurances that full-year trading would be in line with market expectations and exited the stock – which was down by 28.2% at 28p.

[qvg] 12/2/2013 11:53

Masurenguy, I am glad it is you saying "disappointing" this time! But I still share your long term optimism, so took advantage of the opportunity to buy a few more at a good price

[pj 1] 12/2/2013 10:29

Waiting until the dust has settled a little. Looks like they certainly do not want to Sell direct themselves and prefer 3rd Party (Utilities)

Which leads to an obvious conclusion if it is mainly one Co selling this