Reflec Share Discussion Threads

[upthepool] 10/4/2014 21:37

picturehappy;

If you can't post it on here I'm not interested.
If you can't speak about it at an agm I'm not interested.
If all your group is capable of is whispering behind closed doors, I'm not interested.

I will be happy to "take a balanced view" when you have made public your grievances. I don't need to meet your gang.

"Obviously it will necessitate a trip up North". Jeez, can you believe the front of these people.

Make your issues public. Then we will talk again.

[philmac56] 10/4/2014 19:58

Why don't you all just flog your shares and move on some where else and drain that co via legal claims and counter claims..


Move on for Christ sake

[picturehappy] 10/4/2014 18:48

Pool.

Regarding your last para. of post 1392.

We have deliberately not posted on this medium the true facts of our grievances with the directors as if customers, suppliers were to see dirty washing splashed across a public forum it could ultimately damage the company. We did avoid making a scene in the 2013 a.g.m. as we were aware of at least one press reporter was present. This again could have been damaging to the company.

You maybe interested to know that along with your wife, and the shares held in a private Ltd. company you are the 7th. largest P.I. The 9 other largest shareholders have agreed to meet you to put the facts in front of you. You will then be in a position to take a balanced view of the scenario that is facing us, and indeed you may be in a position to assist in solving the stand off we are in. I cannot be any fairer or more reasonable than this. You asked for a surprise !

Obviously it will necessitate a trip up north but given your considerable holding I am sure you can justify the time and money being spent.

Nick

[upthepool] 09/4/2014 17:05

oh ffs - how dull is this.


A couple of questions for "the gangs" mouthpiece as he seems to have come out of hibernation.

Is this the only thing you now have in your possession to have a go at the company about. Perhaps you could answer the following;

1) Are you still going down the legal route that was being banged on about a few months ago? Or, did you not have a case? I guess the answer to that will be no comment!!

2) Did the "whispering campaign" work? Did you consider it a success given the last set of results? I guess the answer to that will be no comment.

3)Specific question about your post. Why would Crewe station not be palatable? Given what I heard from the last agm your gang didn't have the balls to challenge the board on your specific grievances. Why?

4) Another specific question. In fact something you need to prove from your post above. Can you, actually, prove that the BOD "deliberately chose a location to alienate majority shareholders". If you can't, could that be construed as being libellous? (just asking, like, I'm not a lawyer but you might know some).

5) From a personal point of view - it is not easy for me to get to Crewe and I might hold more shares than you do. If so (a) does that make me a "majority" share holder and (b) if it does it renders your last post hugely incorrect.

Phil, I seem to remember you saying that you'd joined "the gang" a few months ago. About your in depth research, your majority share holders, is that number of shares held or number of shareholders. If it is the latter, then your research is meaningless.

'pool

[picturehappy] 09/4/2014 14:38

Reference the March 2014 preliminary statement and words "our intent" and "we have analysed".

In light of Philmiboots research the Board will obviously examine the authenticity of the claims and if the figures are anywhere near accurate the Board will have no alternative other than holding the AGM in the North.

Regulatory authorities take a dim view on Company Director's that deliberately choose locations that alienate majority shareholders attending meetings.

There have been several on the record requests that meetings are held in a Crewe hotel, opposite Crewe Station.

The ease for everyone to reach Crewe is clearly not palatable to the Director's. I wonder why ?

Good work Philmiboots, thank you.

Nick

[scalie] 09/4/2014 12:17

Well that's about what I expected - so why is the Agm in London and why have I been lied to - prob the only shareholder in Rio de Janeiro So we may be holding the Agm here next year

[philmiboots] 08/4/2014 15:56

Right, after all that - "Just a bit of fun" as Peter Snow used to say....

Obviously the numbers change with every trade, and will always effectively be out of date, but using the North South divide definition above (as in red/blue map), and excluding nominee accounts, then the percentage of Reflec SHARES held in the South is approximately 15.5% and in the North 84.5%.

edit: Reflec PLC have provided their breakdown of SHAREHOLDERS as follows:-
North 243 32%
South 275 36%
West 90 12%
Midlands 69 9%
Other (not England/Wales) 89 12%

(excluding Nominee Accounts)

[philmac56] 01/4/2014 14:42

Philmeboots.

Let's get this straight, ones and for all.

I am Welsh, with Scottish blood in my veins.

I am Not British!!!!

So there is no North / South divide in my books

Lol

[philmiboots] 01/4/2014 12:38

Well spotted philmac, nothing gets past you!

Regarding Shareholder demographics this is proving a tad tricky - all depends what you are going to call North and what you are going to call South! Is it a horizontal line at Watford Gap -


or this definition -



Would be handy if REF could give us their actual figures and what criteria they used.

[philmac56] 01/4/2014 10:12

philmeboots

i can see you have updated the graphs

[johndee] 30/3/2014 16:40

Nothing on Reflec on iii as far as I could see.

[philmac56] 30/3/2014 16:30

What I meant was are the savioury few making their views on other boards!!!!!

[philmac56] 29/3/2014 20:35

A silly question!!!!!

Are there other Reflec BB still up and running??????

Lse????
Ii???

[upthepool] 29/3/2014 18:58

Ref: Post 1375.

A new user name to me, and one post according to the profile, basically, slagging off the board. Maybe I'm an old cynic, but who might be behind such a post??

Looking at the last statement in the virgin posters text ..... eh? ..... In the overall scheme of things - have you read the last few company statements?

I didn't attend the last agm up North but heard about it. So, you think that a lorry load of shipped in people (probably from around that area - just a thought) to do their nodding dog impressions when certain individuals / groups screamed "no comment" constitutes a fruitful and fulfilling meeting?

I do believe group train tickets work out a lot cheaper though.

[man1] 29/3/2014 09:25

Hi All,
It goes to show whatever the board does not everyone is going to be happy. I have attended the last two meetings in London , which under the old BOD were non events . But that is no different from last years AGM in winsford when 90% of attendees weren't shareholders ,who just sat through the meeting just intimidating the BOD without asking any questions , then didn't even stay for the buffet because they were all off to the pub to discuss what a laugh they had all had .
So maybe the change in venue is to stop the same happening again.?
Maybe the 90% who gave there proxy will travel to London in person ?
The £2-3 K suggested as the cost of the AGM is insignificant to the legal costs associated with responding to shareholders with undisclosed issues .
Living in Cumbria i have myself asked the BOD to hold a meeting up my neck of the woods .
At least the BOD is trying to reach a variety of shareholders .
I have recently sent out a number of emails ,as i have had discussions with the BOD with holding a kind of road show around the country where shareholders can discuss issues with at least one Board member , if we can get a number of shareholders in a common place .
Or i am quite happy to try and arrange a tour round the factory at Winsford .The BOD are quite happy to accommodate these options in the future .

Keep the faith

[philmac56] 29/3/2014 07:27

Well where ever the AGM is located, I won't be able to get to it.

Work commitment won't allow me.

Prob be different next year.

The Co is generating cash for the shareholders, divi increasing yr on yr, why the fuss

[scalie] 28/3/2014 23:59

Philmiboots, do you want to do the hard work or do you want to pass me the 100 sheets of A4 because i want to get to the bottom of this - or can you tell me how i can get a copy of the list and who much it cost etc
Regards, Scalie

[piebaldlurcher] 28/3/2014 18:54

As a small shareholder I have sporadically dipped in and out of this BB. However on this occasion I have been moved to comment as I cannot fathom the logic for Reflec holding the AGM in London. From memory the last time Reflec held its AGM in London, very few shareholders attended and an even smaller number of stockbrokers. The AGM was over in about 40 minutes as the brokers wanted to nip off the next AGM or company briefing and the shareholders wanted to see London. Besides, the train fares would make it an expensive day out for shareholder. A day return ticket from Oxford would be £24, from Norwich £50.50 and from Brighton £27.30. Don't ask about Somerset where a day return ticket is about £70. In addition there would be tube fare to and from the AGM venue. A reasonably typical shareholder with 10 shares who lives in Brighton is highly unlikely to shell out £27.30 to hear how his dividend of £75 might be improved. That is if the shareholder can take time off work to attend.
However when the AGM was in London some years ago, it made economic sense. The majority of the directors lived in London, the company's bankers were in London, the company's lawyers were in London, as were the company's brokers Seymoor Pearce in whose offices the AGM was held, probably at no cost to Reflec. Holding the AGM in London in May will be an expensive exercise for the company. Along with the directors, its accountants, its lawyers, its registrars, etc there is likely to be some 10-12 people whose travel costs and time will have to be paid by the company. As the return train fare to London from Crewe, which seems to be the nearest station to Winsford, is in the region £110.-£150, then the company's travel bill is going to be in the region of £1,500. The advisors are likely to want a full day's fees for their time as opposed to two or three hours for attending the AGM near Winsford. The venue for the AGM is unlikely to be free. In addition, for a company that is so cost conscious, it is odd to hold the AGM where the venue is likely to be more expensive along with the travelling costs, etc for the board and its entourage of advisors. I am not impressed with the reasons for holding the AGM in London as the total costs could well be in the region of at least £2,500.
Unless the company has cast iron guarantees from its groups of shareholders which it consulted, that a sizeable number (20-30?) will attend, then perhaps fair enough. I hope the company's analysis for southern based is accurate. Perhaps a second opinion on this might surface. However if only some 10 shareholders attend then the cost to the company per shareholder will be about £250 each. Last year's AGM probably cost in the region of £1,000 and with 40+ shareholders the cost per shareholder to the company would have been in the region of £25. Even if my estimates are inaccurate the AGM costs per shareholder will be considerably more in London than in the Winsford area. This would seem to be a company losing its grip on managing its costs for no obvious advantage.

[philmac56] 27/3/2014 21:54

I must be the only one in Wales!!!¡!¡!¡!!!!¡

[scalie] 27/3/2014 18:09

Well fair play to Ref they got back to me very promptly...With regard to your query. We arrived at the statistic, that a "significant
amount" of shareholders are based in London and the south, after analysing the
Share Register. This showed that a significant amount of individual
shareholders are based in this area. Your Board, therefore felt that it is only
fair to these shareholders to hold the AGM in a convenient location to them.
Also we have had discussions with several groups of shareholders, who have
suggested different locations for the AGM. As a result of the analysis and the
comments from these shareholders, your Board has decided to hold the AGM in
London for the first time in about 7 years. This will give southern based
shareholders an opportunity to attend the AGM.

Think i was at that last one in London 7 years ago. Anyway they analysed the shareholder register.

[philmac56] 27/3/2014 14:35

steva1

thanks for clarifying that position, ta