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[dusseldorf] 07/2/2013 13:15

JoJo_Jo - You appear to be a complete muppet and I have clearly wasted several minutes of my time engaging with you.

[jojo_jo] 07/2/2013 13:06

Dusseldorf,
I have already pointed out clearly misleading statements in your earlier posts. I haven't looked too closely, but there may be more.
So you have NOT simply pointed out facts. On the contrary you have been dishonest AND cast aspertions on the integrity of directors, including a former high ranking Standard Chartered Bank executive.

I see you are again highlighting the negatives (why if you're not 'short' here?). Very noticeably you didn't highlight the phrase "the banks remain supportive of the business". Why not highlight that!?

I have already clarified the point about the banks.

However all this 'bank' talk is just pointless negativity and made totally redundant by the proposed offer. The bank are 'supportive'. They are going to be even happier now the deep-pocketed Tosca&Co concert party are underwriting the company with a proposed offer.

In answer to your supposed 'facts'...
a). NO offer is firm until it goes unconditional (it doesn't stop them completing, or stop the shares trading near the offer price permitting holders to sell)
b) ANY offer can be amended, or counterbid until it goes unconditional
c) ANY company can go into administration, even those in very sound financial condition
d) Where does it say 'they will not be'. More dishonesty?

So much for your so-called facts!
Just another de-ramping short-seller by the sound of all your posts on here.
Claiming to state facts, which are either not facts at all or broadly applicable to a multitude of companies and situations.

I've been looking at all kinds of stocks, including some like this, since about 1983. I've also employed thousands of people over that time. I know something about 'real businesses' and 'employment' such as this company undertakes.

Happy to be holding and buying/adding. I've put my money where my mouth is, and remain very happy to have done so.
Others should do what's best for them. If you want to take the 'advice' of bears who have been shown up for their dishonesty and slander, that's up to you. I don't give advice.

IMPO/DYOR
Jo

[stegrego] 07/2/2013 13:03

Facts - now youve gone and done it. Jojo wont like this. He / She only deals in supposition.

[dusseldorf] 07/2/2013 12:31

JoJo_Jo - Think what you like, I observe crash stocks and look for a good entry point assuming the risk/reward balance is right. I recently traded NVTA from 1.2p > 7p whilst well known bears Lucien Myers and Evil K were shorting.

The reason I post that I may buy if it goes lower is because I have the benefit of being a non-holder and don't have to average down. I'm not in a rush or blind to the negative views.

You are also entitled to your view, I'm simply pointing out facts.
a) An offer may not be forthcoming
b) An offer could be below the current price (I've also indicated higher alternatives based on volume weighted average price)
c) The company can still go into administration
d) The company indicated they may not meet covenents in March i.e. will be in default. Though bank says they are supportive if capital injection is not forthcoming they will not be.
from 23rd jan
...the Company had agreed with its lending banks that they would reset covenants and defer the start of the repayment of the loan principal until June 2013.

Since that date, trading has continued to be difficult. In particular: ....

.....The forecasts also indicate that the financial covenants for March and June 2013 may not be met. The Company is in constructive negotiations with its banking partners regarding resetting the covenants for 2013 and the Company believes that the banks remain supportive of the business.

Unlike your posts, you will find it hard to counter my statements as I base them on facts and 12 years of looking at stocks exactly the same as this one. If I have posted anything that's incorrect fine, I will update.

[jojo_jo] 07/2/2013 12:11

Dusseldorf,
you have clearly shown your true colours with your posts. You are just de-ramping, then playing the 'good guy' by suggesting you 'may' buy.
Some people may be gullible enough to listen to you, but I'm not.
Most offers start this way now, for legal reasons they have to appear non-committal.
You talk about DD. The Tosca&Co concert party probably know as much about the company as the (new) directors. They don't need to do much DD. They will know a lot already, and the proposed offer opens the remaining doors. They know money is needed and are willing to put in substantial funding to protect their already large (72%+) interest.
The current BOD (one ex-Standard Chartered Exec) were picked and brought in for their integrity. They won't be doing anything 'irregular'. Are you suggesting they have or would? It sounds like it to me!

To say the company is in default is plainly a misleading lie. The banks 'may' have to reset covenants at the end of March or June. They will certainly not be in default. What an obviously misleading lie that is! Why are you misleading people with such statements?

There is virtually NO chance of admin. in my opinion, and this company is worth a lot more than £5m in my opinion.

You are clearly a bear, and I doubt you have any intention of investing. You just highlight the negatives and endeavour to mislead people, as I have indicated.

I am happy to keep buying at 0.50p. For me this is a no-brainer.
Everybody should do what they think is best for them. If you believe the de-ramping short-sellers here, stay on the sidelines. I don't for a minute and have stated my continuing intentions. For me this is no gamble. I now personally regard it as safe. Others should decide for themselves.

IMPO/DYOR/NAI
Jo

[dusseldorf] 07/2/2013 11:35

JoJo_Jo - The proposal is indicative, non-binding and without backing of directors - it's not an official offer. The concert party also reserve the right to offer lower than 0.54p 'if' they decide to proceed with an offer. OK they have suggested they would be willing to make an offer above 0.54, but there are lots of factors that can affect this during due diligence - we all know that historic accounting irregularities collapsed the price.

Administration is always an option, quite simply in the absence of further funding the company is in default by end March and could be forced into administration.

In short, no price is guaranteed and you are gambling on a positive outcome. I too may take a gamble should the price drop again, but I'm under no illusion any money 'invested' could be written to 0p or 1p.

[jojo_jo] 07/2/2013 11:17

Dusseldorf, I think they've made it as clear as they can that they're going to pay 0.54p. They may end up having to pay more. Any suggestion of admin. is plain ridiculous. Won't happen. Was never an option - even before this offer. The 'injection of significant capital following successful completion' guarantees and reassures the bank.

Do what you want everyone.
I'm a buyer at 0.50p or below (wish I could have bought for less. Couldn't get a worthwhile quantity for less than 0.50p). An easy short term (minimum) 8% return impo. Tosca&Co's brokers will be happy to take all the stock the MMs hoover up for them sub-0.53p. I'm happy to hoover them up sub 0.50p.

IMPO/DYOR/NAI
Jo

[dusseldorf] 07/2/2013 10:59

JoJo_Jo - you can lose, you seem to blindly be buying on an assumption an offer of 0.54or above is coming. a) the offer could be lower, b) there could be no offer at all and company goes into admin

My personal view is there will be an offer as it's the quickest route to gaining ownership - administration means other bidders can also come in and purchase/counter bid.

Where the offer is for me is the unknown, I nearly bought 0.46p but backed out due to sale volumes. The offer moves quickly however, on much smaller volumes than the sell drops, suggesting MM's are confident about a positive outcome.

[jojo_jo] 07/2/2013 10:54

Unlike the short-sellers here, who just want your money, I am not asking anyone to take my advice.

However this is easy money at 0.50p or less. Just bought more. Can't lose! Not a huge profit I admit, but happy to take 8%.
Very Happy, just like I was with my GMA trade!

IMPO/DYOR/NAI
Jo

PS. Obviously 1.5p went out of the window when this offer appeared yesterday. Short sellers typically post old, out of date, out of context posts just to mislead people.

PPS. The fact is there is 0.54p minimum guaranteed here, by Tosca&Co. The door is still open to one or more 'white knights' who could still bid a lot more for this, as it's clearly a steal at this price for Tosca&Co. I'm happy to be both guaranteed a profit AND get a free bet on a possible takeover. I think they call it a 'win-win' situation. Love it!

[dontshootthemessenger] 07/2/2013 10:35

LOL someone who was talking about 1.5p to 3p (NOW!) thinks that his advice has any credibility that you can make '15-20%'

[jojo_jo] 07/2/2013 10:32

Anyone who is stupid enough to follow the advice of a short-seller and sell below 0.54p is just mad impo!

The creditor bank knows all about the 0.54p take-over (by companies with more than enough money to pay them off in a minute).

I'm in for more at this price - an easy 15 - 20% profit. A real no-brainer impo!

IMPO/DYOR/NAI
Jo

[dusseldorf] 07/2/2013 10:31

JoJo_Jo - I would suggest you don't use the phrase 'can't lose' with an average below 0.54. There is a possibility they make a lower offer than 0.54 or that they decide to write off their investment and await a repurchase from an administration scenario. I believe these are unlikely courses of event however a £4m valuation on a company this size suggests most people believe there is little value left if any.

Still, an offer of 0.7p/1p, taking private, inject capital, would settle everything very quickly IMO.

[dontshootthemessenger] 07/2/2013 10:28

Who'd take investment advice from a secretary ?

[dontshootthemessenger] 07/2/2013 10:21

This is getting smashed now.

Longs made the wrong call. Obviously stock market novices.

[dusseldorf] 07/2/2013 10:11

FYI the 6 month volume weighted average price, which is approx, is 0.95p/share. I would suggest that is a 'ceiling' of any potential offer

[dontshootthemessenger] 07/2/2013 10:03

Could creditors move before shareholders to preserve value for themselves ?

[dontshootthemessenger] 07/2/2013 10:03

slumping now

[dontshootthemessenger] 07/2/2013 09:02

yes that is why jojo_jo has disappeared up his own backside

LOL

[graham1ty] 07/2/2013 08:49

Dusseldorf

There is no firm offer yet. What a pressure group can do is put pressure on the Board to make sure that all options are looked at, from a shareholders point of view. The trouble is the banks just want this saved.....do not care about shareholders. The board ditto just want to keep their jobs and their shareholdings are irrelevant. The non-Execs have so far been pretty spineless.

It is however the duty of the Board to look at all options, to hold out for a better offer, to consider other outside investors etc etc. We have no assurance they will do any of that

[dusseldorf] 07/2/2013 08:44

There is no firm offer at present, so pointless setting up or participating in a group called 'say not to' etc.. Perhaps there is some advantage in collating details in advance, but the only influence the group could have is perhaps the ear of the directors, it will not be possible to get more than (IMO) 10% into a group..

[dontshootthemessenger] 07/2/2013 08:44

Secretaries should stick to filing and answering the phone.