Circle Property Share Discussion Threads

[pinhead3] 06/10/2006 16:34

sheeneqa - 6 Oct'06 - 16:26 - 470 of 470 (Filtered)

[pinhead3] 06/10/2006 16:20

OK we get the message, move on!

[sheeneqa] 06/10/2006 14:59

Yep some people just do not care buying shares in companies that exploit the poor......Probably owns gaming stocks tambien....shame on you! Ethics/morals get some.......

Karma what goes around is coming around!

[pinhead3] 06/10/2006 14:27

Drewz
It's a good job that the Kinsenda mine is near one of those all important rivers then!

[drewz] 06/10/2006 12:16

Democratic Republic of Congo - what a place to do business.

Watched that prog on the Beeb late last night - Equator, where Simon Reeve was travelling through Gabon, then DRC and on thru Uganda. DRC was like being back in the stone age!

Only 300 miles of paved roads in the whole vast country.

4 million dead in the fighting since 1998.

The locals have to use rivers for transport as roads are often unpassable in the rains even with 4x4's.

They have these huge sea barges on the river Congo which people book a space on to travel up river, then they set up camp on board under a bit of plastic sheet and wait for departure.

The local guide chap was asked how often they sail, how long people have to wait for a departure. "Minimum waiting is one month, maximum 3 months", he said quite calmly. I fell off the sofa at that point.

[sheeneqa] 06/10/2006 09:21

Down she goes! where it ends nobody knows...................

[sheeneqa] 05/10/2006 12:40

Nasty looking chart, looks like people are waking up and looking to more ethical investing........

[pinhead3] 04/10/2006 08:39

Chris didn't go into specifics regarding release date.
I think everyone would prefer to have the job done thoroughly now rather than get to the BFS & find that the resources estimate is flawed.

My guess (& that's all it is) is by the end of this month.

[addas99] 04/10/2006 08:11

Thanks pinhead...and presumably the copper resource update from Hinoba any day now?

[pinhead3] 04/10/2006 07:48

Received a response from Chris Jordinson to list of questions today, to summarise.

6 months of drilling is required at Hinoba-an to calculate gold resources, these will therefore be released after the copper resource update. So approx Q1 2007.

Bankable Feasibility study on Haib will take 'a significantly shorter timeframe to complete' than Hinoba-an as infil drilling not required. All ready stated that will start mid 2007 so I'd estimate end 2007 or Q1 2008.

Confirmed that the revenue in the interims was due to Misoshi stock pile processing & he will come back to me on volume of copper sold/price per tonne. Currently he is on the road & does not have the information to hand.

Not actively looking for further acquisitions but will consider any that come to hand, concentrating on current assets.

[sheeneqa] 03/10/2006 23:32

pinbrain you waz warned, lots more to fall, like those gamin stocks, makin money of others misfortunes, bad karma my son! Wise UP pronto!


Hattori_Hanzo - 27 Jun'06 - 15:23 - 338 of 459


wassaper - Fair enough. I understand these issues are a difficult dilemma and nothing is ever completely black and white. I'll continue to do my research into the situation.

ps: Yes, I wouldn't buy Halliburton either! ;)

Infact, I feel that company is an extremely dubious investment, far more so than CRC.

NB: I own shares in WTI, so hopefully we can forget about our differences and have a friendly chat on that thread sometime, where I shan't be poking you with a stick about ethics! ;) Exciting times ahead for WTI too (hopefully).



Blessings - Yes, that description of The Forrest Group doesn't make happy reading, though it doesn't tell half the story of their possibly dubious dealings and influence.
Unfortunately (apart from worrying info about the DRC in general) it was CRC's association with The Forrest Group that first alerted me to the fact CRC may not be an ethical investment.

[unionhall] 03/10/2006 21:16

I guess the dewatering will be announced soon....

[stemis] 03/10/2006 19:47

No-one is arguing that directors shouldn't be reasonable incentivised. However incentives should be proportionate and balanced against the interests of shareholders. 58% of the options went to non executives, including non-executives who are only there to represent their own interests (the Forrests). Who is balancing the interests of management and shareholders if the directors are basically awarding themselves options?

No-one would have had a problem if the executives had received options approved by a remuneration committee of non executives who themselves did not participate. Especially if the options had been, say 3% of the company i.e. 1.8 million. Thats £1.8 million to share for getting the share price to £2. That seems quite generous to me. Its not like they haven't already got options. Once they got through the first stage of development, the company could issue further options at a higher price to encourage further performance from executives. A logical progressive incentive scheme, not some raid on the cookie jar when the top's been left off.

[goatherd] 03/10/2006 18:56

I thought that, under the Cadbury rules, non-execs should NEVER be awarded options? Cadbury is not binding, of course, but this does raise a query about corporate governance.

Any comments?

[adam] 03/10/2006 18:51

With respect that is not true. I did not say I expect them to do it for peanuts. It is a matter of degree. I have no problem with, say 10% of the FD capital of the company being for the benefit of directors (I think the AIM guidelines are for 5%). As long as it is at an appropriate price. They will enter production next year and they have cash and finance in place, so CRC as we know will get re-rated. IN the space of 12 months at most they will pocket 10s of millions of pounds. Nice work if you can get it!

[pinhead3] 03/10/2006 18:38

If you bothered to check out the salaries of these guys you'd realise that they aren't exactly the highest paid directors in the world.
CEO for example is on an employment contract of $120K a year, I'm paid that much & I'm just an accountant!

You pay peanuts, you get monkeys. Don't forget that if the company doesn't succeed they don't make any money either. I'd be more than happy if they double their money on these share options as we all will too. You all seem to expect them to do it & only receive £60K (& less) a year.

[stemis] 03/10/2006 17:49

Come on pinhead3, this is indefensible.

Look, I'm happy for management to be adequately incentivised and their interests aligned with those of the shareholders, but this is just taking the p*ss, surely:-

Copper Resources Corporation announces that on 2nd October 2006 the Remuneration Committee of the board approved the grant to directors and management of 7,500,000 options to subscribe to common shares of the Company at an exercise price of £1.00

Well 7.5 million shares is 12.4% of the existing share capital and included in the beneficiaries areC Jordinson, Chief Executive Officer and Director 1,500,000
M Alland, Executive Vice Chairman 1,500,000
SE Jonah, Non-Executive Chairman 1,000,000
G Arthur Forrest, Non-Executive Vice Chairman 1,000,000
M Anastassiou, Non Executive Director 1,000,000
G Andrew Forrest, Non Executive Director 1,000,000
R Marshall, Non Executive Director 350,000Since this is the entire board of directors, including the non executives, clearly the Remuneration Committee (whoever they are because the membership is not disclosed either in the accounts or on the web site) can hardly be said to be acting independently (as opposed to, say, unrestrictedly lining their own pockets). Who exactly is looking after the interests of shareholders in this?

Add these new options to the 4.1 million of existing options outstanding and 6.9 million of warrants and that's options/warrants over 18.4 million shares compared to a share capital of 60.6 million. That's 23.3% of the upside of ordinary shareholders.

It makes you seriously wonder how much of any upside in CRC will ever make its way past the sticky hands of the directors.

It won't surprise you to know that the total number of shares owned by the board (excluding the Forrest's of course) is only 557,333 or 0.9%.

The worst side of small cap miners.

[adam] 03/10/2006 17:30

pinhead3.

Options (to 2011 you note) are not a placing at £1. They will only get exercised near expiry, and carry no risk to the holder. We hope that CRC will not need a placing by the way, but if it did, these options wouldn't help. They are there purely for the benefit of the directors and will not help fund a startup company like this.

Now on to the "premium" bit. This done at a time when there are worries about the up-coming Congo elections. When, after constant good news from CRC with the Philipines resource, the Congo financing and even the Namibian resource, when small non-producing mining stocks are out of favour. Sorry, but it is entirely cynical, entirely opportunistic and very, very greedy.

'nuff said/

[pinhead3] 03/10/2006 17:00

Oh really I don't remember you warning us about anything!

It's actually a 10.4% increase in the fully diluted shares issue not 13% plus they are paying for them.
The options are at £1, a 23.4% premium to the current price so think of it another way they've just secured £7.5m of potential funding 23% above the current share price
If this was placement through an institution you'd all be rubbing your hands together!

[sheeneqa] 03/10/2006 16:26

YOU WAZ WARNED,,,,,,,,,


LONDON, United Kingdom - 3 October 2006

Copper Resources Corporation (AIM: CRC.L) ("CRC", "the Company") announces that
on 2nd October 2006 the Remuneration Committee of the board approved the grant
to directors and management of 7,500,000 options to subscribe to common shares
of the Company at an exercise price of £1.00, with the options being
exercisable at any time up to and including 2nd October 2011. The granting of
options is as follows:

--1,000,000 to SE Jonah, Non-Executive Chairman

--1,500,000 to M Alland, Executive Vice Chairman

--1,000,000 to G Arthur Forrest, Non-Executive Vice Chairman

--1,500,000 to C Jordinson, Chief Executive Officer and Director

--1,000,000 to M Anastassiou, Director

--1,000,000 to G Andrew Forrest, Director

--350,000 to R Marshall, Director

--150,000 to M Gordon, Chief Geologist