Birse Share Discussion Threads

[relko] 10/1/2006 22:28

So who woke this board up?
Go back to sleep.
SP going nowhere for next couple of years.

[chrissey] 10/1/2006 17:00

Most probably priveliged (not supposed to say 'insider trading') info in regard to a major contract win which will be notified by usual channels in next few days?

IMHO of course!

Either that or the Birse board are to announce their collective retirement!

Now that would be the equivalent of Carlsberg building bridges!

[micos] 10/1/2006 16:06

What's in the wind today, then?
Sells are 50% ahead of buys and the price moves more than any day in the last year.

[no 1 the embankment] 19/12/2005 14:02

They may be good at building bridges but not so good at building
Data Centers.Citi had them by the proverbials and they knew it.

[micos] 16/12/2005 12:07

Could this be a bid target now with all the bad news out and that nice loss to write off future profits against?

[wild cat and pussy] 16/12/2005 09:41

Interesting action today - punters prepared to believe that worst is over. Given history, what we really need is the directors to put their hand in their pocket and buy.

[eithin] 16/12/2005 09:20

Birse swings into H1 loss on litigation costs

LONDON (AFX) - Construction and plant hire company Birse Group PLC swung
into a heavy loss at the interim stage mainly as a result of litigation costs
associated with Citibank.
For the six months to end-October, the group recorded a pretax loss of 9.9
mln stg compared to a profit of 667,000 a year earlier.
However it said that conditions are improving in all areas of its ongoing
operations.
bam

Sitting tight for income. 8% yld. Could be bottom !!!

[wild cat and pussy] 16/12/2005 08:08

what a horrible set of financials. only consolation is the maintained divi.
I'm hoping that the new mgt have taken the kitchen sink approach, although it is noted that losses will continue on part of the build business until the end of next year.
Other big negative is profits down on continuiing business. Cash position improved, due to sale and deferment of payment to citibank.
Almost surprising that the divi is maintained - but maybe an important vote of confidence in the future of bie?

.

[toob] 12/12/2005 17:30

The acid test will be the cash flow in the period. If they have halted the previous outflow, it moght pressage a turnaround, and it will also make managements job that bit easier ( paying subbies etc).

[muckshifter] 10/12/2005 18:12

Hope you're right Bounty Hunter. Last time Birse were in serious financial difficulties, about ten years ago, they had something like £45 million of "claims" included in debtors. Without that value they were really insolvent at that time. Sure enough, as they began to recover, they wrote off something like £30 million of these claims over a few years.
Regards.

[the bounty hunter] 10/12/2005 10:40

Based on recent years, half-timers should be out next week. The outlook in July was as follows:

Outlook

The Group continues to improve the overall quality of its business although it
remains exposed to the uncertainties existing in respect of the Citibank
Litigation and for the Group in respect of the Build business. Our strategic
withdrawal from the loss making sectors of the Build market and the consequent
restructuring of Birse Build have to date gone broadly to plan. In our core
engineering operations the transition to new customer procurement practices has
suppressed production volumes in the year and also reduced demand for the hire
of heavy duty plant. This lost production will, however, be recovered in future
periods. Therefore, with record order and enquiry levels in our core operations
combined with the quality of contract awards secured in the year we continue to
add impetus to the Group's underlying forward momentum.

The citibank saga is behind us.Will result in a further exceptional, but hopefully trading is heading in the right direction.

The high level of debtors and creditors at the last year end, probably explains several posters' comments of suppliers' being paid late. Bie are getting paid late and hence this pain is being passed onto their subbies.

In April, refernce was made to a record order book - will this be evident in 2005/06?

Restructuring of birse build should be progressing. Order numbers indicate that revenues from this source should be down to £30m or less (per comments on orders) from £61m. Losses from this business last year were £7.1m. Can we expect some positve news here?

The other main uncertainty relates to £7m of debtors which is subject to arbitration. This appears to be in the books at 100%. This seems to be the main worry?

Can recovery play get going this year?

[muckshifter] 29/11/2005 12:51

No toob, a substantial sub contractor who is now several months late being paid because the money is just not there.
Regards

[toob] 29/11/2005 12:38

m s , i presume the discussions were with a supplier?

[mitchy] 28/11/2005 12:50

muckshifter - have closed my position in Birse this morning.

[muckshifter] 28/11/2005 11:29

mitchy,
In post 269 you asked the following questions, amongst others;-
1)Do you think Birse has a future? (if no then disregard remaining questions)
and
4)Do you see the debt in BIE as a)minor b)significant c)overwhelming d) terminal.

To which I gave my answers at that time.

After conversations today, I would reduce the chances of survival given in my original response to Q1, over the next 2 years, to 60/40. And I would bet that the first payment to Citi is made in shares.
Regards.

[donalduck] 27/11/2005 18:10

Birse Civils awarded £18m coastal defence project

Birse Civils has been awarded an £18m contract by Wyre Borough Council to undertake an extensive coastal defence project in Lancashire.

The project involves the construction of new coastal defence works and the renovation of Cleveleys promenade.

It will involve the installation of precast concrete sea defence units as well as extensive pilling and drainage, followed by hard and soft landscaping.

The project is due for completion by the end of 2007.



17 Nov 2005 16:01

[mitchy] 20/11/2005 13:27

More talk in the press about Olympic contracts.

[muckshifter] 18/11/2005 15:54

IvyEileen,
Your reading is a feasible alternative interpretation... but the fact that I know that they have been unable, note unable not unwilling, to pay some of their principle subcontractors accounts on at least two occasions within the last 3 months on the due date, is the underlying reason for my view.

And I'm sure that Citibank will be fully aware of that predicament and the possibility of winning the court case against a "man of straw" as I believe its known. This is why I believe they settled, as it's really in neither parties interest to bankrupt Birse during the court action, or during the prolongued period allowed for paying (note - with interest) the award.
Regards.

[ivyeileen] 18/11/2005 09:36

Re: Muchshifter's note 273 of 7th November, which I have just read. He says questions ability to maintain dividend and cites "I think the clause allowing them to pay one of their "hire purchase" settlement payments to citibank in shares is clear acknowledgement" as reasson.

Let me pose opposite thought - for company, shelling out shares is preferable to paying cash (think, by way of analogy, of scrip dividends)... helps cash flow and (separate point) the retention improves the overall cash position, with both of which any decent Fin Dir is always concerned. It could therefore be a positive and not a negative point. For Citibank ... well, interesting. Those guys are hard-nosed U.S. bankers for whom cash in hand is king.... but they also know a good deal and push for it when they see one. Could it be they consider BIE shares are a better investment (for foreseeable future, anyway)than the cash going into their Treasury operations ?

overall, however, we shall see what we shall see ...

[tommyjnewton] 08/11/2005 13:12

Nice to get the fat divi this morning.
Looks like a tip somewhere judging by a bunch of small buys this morning and a little tick up. Maybe one of the penny share tip sheets?
Wonder how the scaling down of Birse Build is going?
Are they still capable of constructing stadiums?

[toob] 08/11/2005 11:10

mitchy 269

1.Every firm has a future , but how good/bad is it, that's the question.

2.Because of their cash problems a low 2.

3.I've no doubt it's true because chairmen can't be seen to lie ,but what does it mean, bearing in mind that the work continually slips back? They might have a record amount of orders but if they are eventually spread over a number of years , then this is meaningless happy talk.

4. c- almost overwhelming.

5. From the little I've heard second hand , I'd say they are worse than the majority, and they have been for some time.

6.I'd say at the present share price they are neither short or long. The share price will maintain as long as the divi is maintained...this is the big question. If they dont maintain it the price will halve ( and possibly not stop there). I dont see profit optimism in the chairman's statement , so it's hard to see upside...unless there was a takeover.

7. I sold my considerable holding about two years ago and have regretted the loss of earnings since , buthave slept better.