Arbuthnot Banking Share Discussion Threads

[pyemckay] 12/3/2015 17:36

No, I dont think you are missing anything. I am a holder too and am happy to buy at a discount knowing one day it may reduce significantly.
The market often discounts this type of holding.

[pvb] 12/3/2015 17:36

Possibly depends on what you mean by "getting in to STB". You'll notice they own 51% of STB, are you expecting them to sell that to realise the capital value to ARBB shareholders?

Originally ARRB was STB, although renamed following the acquisition of Arbuthot Latham I am not sure Henry A. would want to let it go, hence the 51%. But what happens when Mr. A. finally retires? Mind you, he is presumably still the majority shareholder in ARBB itself.

[future financier] 12/3/2015 17:16

But if ARBB owns 51% of STB and STB has a MC of £533m (today) then ARBB's interest in STB is worth £272m - which is 24% more than ARBB's own MC of £219m. So everything else in ARBB is valued at less than nil.

Looks like a ludicrously cheap way of getting in to STB?

Or am I missing something?

[strathroyal] 04/2/2015 19:18

Spob - I see that ST has had another attempt at explaining STB's net worth, does this mean he reads this BB?

[huttonr] 04/2/2015 14:14

Spob - re STB stake in the ARBB accounts.

It and Arbuthnot Latham are consolidated into the ARBB figures (as the share holdings in both are over 50%). As such there no overall figure in the accounts.

However, I suggest that you may want to look at the latest figures ie the 2014 interim report and explore Note 1 Operating segments. This shows a P&L and some asset and liability figures which may help you. Also, the STB accounts for the same period show more detail.

[spob] 04/2/2015 13:12

I've been trying to find out what actual value is given to the STB stake within the ARBB accounts

I realise that this value may be out of date, or below market value, etc

but I just want to know what valuation is shown within the ARBB accounts


I have asked Simon Thompson three times now

and he hasn't given me a straight answer yet

So I guess he doesn't have a clue

[strathroyal] 03/2/2015 15:34

Hi Felix,

I'm not saying that the price won't move but that it goes up far less in percentage terms than STB and that won't change unless ARBB reduces it's holding, which it doesn't seem inclined to do. Yes there are buyers for the stake (large trade earlier today shows that)but at what price will ARBB sell?

[felix99] 03/2/2015 15:03

why do you say that - if STB doubles from here are you saying the ARBB share price wont; move?

To narrow the discount to STB mkt cap I agree they ultimately need to sell shares to realise that and close the gap. I am sure it is a matter of time before the yanks want to buy STB and then they will just come along and do a deal with ARBB for their controlling stake.

Then the discount will be gone and ARBB will be 20-30% higher than here just for that. !

[strathroyal] 03/2/2015 14:01

Whilst ARBB shares appear range bound, I see that there have been a couple of trades in STB at just over £30. It appears that the only way for ARBB to advance would be for them to reduce their stake in STB which doesn't appear likely in the short term.

[neilgbudd] 22/1/2015 07:53

Thanks PVB. I didn't realise they only own a majority share in Secure. Can you shed any light whether ARBB have a net debt or net cash balance like most traditional companies? Thanks in advance.

[pvb] 21/1/2015 20:19

I'm fairly new to banking shares and am looking to potentially invest. Can someone please give some further insight into why ARBB spin off, Secure Bank is valued so much more highly (13 x Forecast 2015 PBT to MCAP) than ARBB (6 x)? Am I missing something here?

STB is regarded as one of the 'new' challenger retail banks and seems to be currently doing rather well. Their customer base increased 51% to end of 2013 financial year. The banks underlying profit before tax has increased 220% since the flotation in 211. ARBB still own about 51% of STB.

On the other hand, apart from the remaining part of STB that they own, Arbuthnot Banking Group comprises Arbuthnot Latham, private banking and wealth management. This also grew in the financial year 2013, but not on the same scale as STB.

Interestingly, this company was originally called Secure Trust Bank (still says so on my share certificate!) but has since changed its name to Arbuthnot Banking Group after the takeover of Arbuthnot Latham and then spun out the Secure Trust Bank department.

[neilgbudd] 20/1/2015 19:47

I'm fairly new to banking shares and am looking to potentially invest. Can someone please give some further insight into why ARBB spin off, Secure Bank is valued so much more highly (13 x Forecast 2015 PBT to MCAP) than ARBB (6 x)? Am I missing something here?

Also, does ARBB have a net debt or net cash balance like most traditional companies? The only really commentary I could find in the last interims was along the lines of 'capital rations, liquidity and funding are strong and better than the larger banks'.

Appreciate your input here.

Thanks in advance

[pvb] 14/1/2015 21:55

not sure that its such a great deal.
4% yield?

Wish I could get 4% on cash! ;-)

[pvb] 14/1/2015 21:54

Just general stuff:

[davebowler] 09/1/2015 11:53

18 December 2014

ARBUTHNOT BANKING GROUP PLC

Mortgage Portfolio Acquisition

Arbuthnot Banking Group PLC ("Arbuthnot" or the "Group") today announces that its subsidiary Arbuthnot Latham ("AL" or "the Bank") has completed the purchase of a residential mortgage portfolio.

The mortgages are being acquired from the administrators of the Dunfermline Building Society ("DBS"). The portfolio has been in run off since 2009 and was previously acquired by DBS from other originators principally GMAC with the balances being geographically distributed around the UK.

Based on balances at 31 October 2014, the portfolio consists of loans totalling GBP117.6 MN of which 58 per cent are residential buy to let and the remaining are owner occupied. The average loan to value is 72 per cent with a current expected yield of approximately 4 per cent.

The consideration of GBP106.3 MN has been satisfied by cash from the Group's resources.

Having regard to the recent developments in the Sterling Monetary Framework, including the Funding for Lending Scheme ("FLS"), this transaction will further diversify AL's asset base which may be offered as collateral. This should enable the Bank to use more sophisticated and stable mechanisms, with which to manage its liquidity.

Enquiries:

[pyemckay] 18/12/2014 18:15

not sure that its such a great deal.
4% yield?

[pvb] 18/12/2014 18:09

Arbuthnot Latham has acquired a residential mortgage portfolio from the administrators of Dumfermline Building Soc.

[pvb] 10/11/2014 16:30

“I’m guessing [Mr Cohen and other investors are] probably taking a view that past performance is a likely indicator of future performance.”

Hah! Of course, we don't know what Mr. Cohen's thinking is, do we?
But here is what some of the insiders have been doing recently:



Don't blame them, though!

[topvest] 22/10/2014 19:36

Yes, all looking very good.